歡迎收聽「思維轉換力量」播客，這是一個面向青少年及其相關成年人的節目，我們將在這裡進行坦誠而直接的對話。我是主持人法蒂瑪貝，思維轉換專家。歡迎大家！今天我們邀請到的是布萊恩·薩切塔。他來自馬薩諸塞州波士頓地區，是一位作家和心理健康倡導者。

他也是「Get Out of Your Head」的創始人。這是一本書，一個品牌，更是一個社群。正如他所說，這本書對心理健康的態度是實事求是的。今天，我們將重點討論「隔離」。布萊恩，你今天過得怎麼樣？

I'm doing pretty good. Thanks, Fatima, and I hope you're doing well too. I I am. I'm looking forward to this conversation. One of the reasons I, that I noticed you, was the no bullshit approach to mental health.

這句話真的讓我注意到你了，因為我太喜歡了。太棒了。行銷做得真棒。至於原因，我很抱歉。繼續吧。

I was just saying that that's great. It's, effective marketing then. Yeah. It is. It attracts, I I think, the right people, because I have the same mentality.

So we're gonna talk about isolation, what that is, what it isn't, why it matters. But, one of the things that you say on your website, and I've heard others say that there's a mental health crisis. And to that, I say, what mental health crisis with our youth? Yeah. There's there's none.

顯然沒有。對吧？我們都是完美的。是啊，是啊。

相當有意思。我每天都會看一份新聞簡報，裡面總結了所有關於市場和金融的新聞，以及你可能想知道的故事。對吧？這週裡面有一篇關於喬納森·海特新書的文章。他之前寫過一本書，叫做《美國精神的溺愛》，這本新書叫做《焦慮的世代》。

And the book and then also the article are focused on the fact that we have a a youth mental health crisis. Right? And his book, which I actually just finished, was centered around the idea that kids used to grow up in a play based society. Right? Where it was like, they had a childhood where they were in front of kids all the time playing and figuring out how to interact with different kids and grow up and learn, relationships and all that.

And now they are being put through what is called what I guess Haidt would call a a phone based childhood. And the difficulty with something like that, right, is it leads to a lot of isolation, but then it also doesn't necessarily allow kids the development they need in terms of having face to face conversations with people, like learning and understanding what, you know, tone of voice is and and body, you know, body movements and and posture and all those sorts of subtle cues in conversations that help us figure out what the other person is expressing, right? And so his whole book is looking at the youth mental health crisis, from a broad lens and then also offering some ideas as to what parents and educators might be able to do to help, mitigate this new crisis. So I I thought the book was really interesting. I thought it was effective and great, and it also just feeds into the conversation that we're having where there is a serious crisis and it's not just affecting, you know, people who live in cities that are a little bit older and single.

對吧？現在這種現像已經蔓延到各個角落，也影響了孩子。我有一個侄女和一個侄子，我正在讀這本書，想到他們即將經歷海特所說的“手機童年”，我感到有點害怕。然後，我開始思考，我該如何幫助他們在成長過程中減輕一些危機。明白嗎？

But why is it a crisis? I mean, phones are great. We can look at stuff, and we can learn more stuff, and we can do stuff on the phone. I mean, we don't need to talk to other people. Right?

所以，我的意思是，顯然，這有點像個玩笑的問題。對吧？嗯。你知道，這又回到了我們作為一個物種是如何進化的。對吧？

And then, you know, I I I don't have all the answers. I don't I don't know if anybody necessarily does, but even if you went back a few thousand years. Right? And you said, okay. Humans for a long time have lived in small tribes.

你知道，科技在人類歷史的脈絡下是一項全新的發明。對吧？嗯。我們的大腦進化方式和我們連結的方式都圍繞著面對面的互動，就像我剛才提到的那樣，你知道，有很多東西會被遺漏。當我們發短信時，你聽不到語調，你無法理解我的肢體語言等等，所以，我不知道這是否老套，但這種例子可能在喜劇節目或類似節目中出現，比如有人在法庭上宣讀短信對話的記錄。

Right? And the person, you know, somebody saying, like, yes, no, whatever, right, and there's just so much loss when you boil down a conversation to just the text, right, just what is spoken. When you actually think about all those subtle cues, if somebody's, like, playing with you, right, and they're saying, like, no, No. Right? You know, and you think about that and you're, like, that person is communicating something under the words themselves.

And so getting back to the question that you asked of, you know, phones are great and all that. Right? They there are things that phones are great for. However, they've become a big, big part of our lives. Right?

And I think that as we sit at home on Instagram and Twitter and Facebook and whatnot, we see a lot of things that scare us. Right? There's the notion of doom scrolling. There's also the idea of comparing ourselves to other people on social media and the idea that on social media, right, we are projecting images of ourselves that are not fully accurate. Right?

We are putting highlight reels into the world and then it's kind of fascinating and terrifying at the same time. I talked about this in one of my blog posts where if you think about it, like, let's say I post a bunch of doctored photos on Instagram, then you do the same. Or or may maybe a better example might be, like, you know, two boys or two two girls, right, who are friends. Let's say the girl, you know, is looking at, her friend's pictures and being like, she might see these pictures and say, oh my goodness. My friend is so attractive and having so much fun.

Why is my life not like that? And that makes that person feel terrible. Right? On the other side of the fence, the girl who's posting those pictures and getting that reaction may feel the same way about her friend. And so in theory, we might be creating a lot of agony for ourselves that is, like, not only it's undue agony, but it also, like, it's just this weird debacle of, like, we're we might all be making ourselves miserable in an attempt to stand out when I think the net effect of all of that might be pretty bad.

這些都是很好的例子。我想從你剛才說的一點中，抽出一點來，回到你剛才那句話裡提到的一點。人類需要彼此。我們生來就是為了這個。因此，我想進一步向觀眾，尤其是成年人解釋一下。

What is isolation, and why why does it, like, why does it matter? Sure. I think there's a couple ways to answer that or look at it. Right? So I think what most of us jump to in our minds is isolation being, and I'll I'll I'll come back to a better definition in a second, but being physically isolated from other people.

Right? Ostracized or separated from other people. Try not to use the definition of the word in the or try not to use the word in the definition of the word itself, but anyway, I digress. So, you know, we think about, okay, if I am isolated it means I'm not surrounded by other people, I'm not connected with other people. There is certainly a physical aspect to isolation, right, but I think probably the more important piece is the emotional aspect, right, because you could Bingo.

There's also there's also an idea of being, you know, lost in a crowd, right, if if you go downtown or into the city or whatever and you're at a parade, just because you are surrounded by other people doesn't mean that you are necessarily connected with those people. Isolation in terms of how it makes us feel. Right? The the feeling piece is the most important part. And so, you know, you may go out to dinner with one friend and you might be in a forest.

And in theory or, you know, you could argue that the two of you are isolated. However, emotionally, if you're having a good conversation and connecting with this person, you're not isolated from one another. Right? And so the important piece when looking at isolation is asking ourselves, are we physically isolated? Because that is something.

But more importantly, are we emotionally isolated? Because when we hold emotions inside, they tend to they tend to grow and fester. Right? And that's not a good place to be. But then also just the fact that you said, right, we all need each other.

That is how we are wired. And so even if, you know, it's not like every time you get together with people, you need to have the most spiritual or emotional conversation. Sometimes just getting together with the guys or the gals and shooting the breeze can be a really effective thing for our minds and our psyches, you know. So, I definitely think about all of those different topics when it comes to isolation. And I guess the last piece, you know, just just talking about the effect of it.

There's definitely some research that has come out in the last few years saying that isolation is reportedly as dangerous to our health as smoking cigarettes. And, you know, I think about that where I live by myself. I'm single. I try to get out there and socialize with people, but there are times where it's easier than others. And I I look at research like that, and and it scares me, you know, and it makes me want to change my habits a little bit and and get more involved in my community and whatnot.

I think also to add to pick up on a little bit of what you just said, when we are too isolated, it is very easy to go down a mental rabbit hole that is basically a booby trap that you just can't get out of by yourself. It's very easy, to go down a rabbit hole of, oh my god. I'm the only one going through this. And that is almost never true. A lot of times, one of the reasons we suffer so much is because we don't open up to one another to say, hey.

I'm suffering with this. And then someone turns around and go, wait a minute. I'm suffering with that too. It's not just me. I mean, I just think about imposter syndrome as an example.

我確實深受其害，尤其是在我的婚紗生意上，它阻礙了我發展事業，而我當時本來可以也應該這樣做。後來我終於克服了。但是，你知道，那是一種把一切都藏在心裡的孤獨感。我還想指出並重申你所說的話。你提到了精神上的孤獨，因為這正是我們現在討論的。

Physical isolation, that's easy, and I think we all can understand that. But I think most people don't even recognize, and not just teens, when they themselves are in a mental mentally isolated place. And I'm gonna just say this, if you for to to listeners, if you're in a place where everything inside your head stays there and no one else knows about it, you're probably and I mean everything. You are probably, isolated in a bad way. And I don't mean that everybody needs to know your business and you don't use any wisdom.

You tell everybody everything. That's bad too. But what I'm saying is that that's one way to look at yourself because I think a lot of people don't recognize when they themselves are in isolation. And I've been a lone ranger thinker most of my life, so I really, really get that. It's difficult to trust people, and sometimes you're just like, you're on a different level than most people around you.

It's very difficult to to talk to people, you know, and open up until you find someone else who's actually on your level. And, and I know that I'm not just talking about myself when I say that because I I I just I know it's not just me. But I think the the mental isolation piece is critical and recognizing that when we're in that. So with that, I wanna ask, let's discuss why do we think that this generation is is, in a in an isolated space? Because you can be and I've seen this because I work with teenagers all the time, go to high schools and speak to them and do workshops, etcetera.

When you see a group of teenagers in a room, they could all be there could be 20 people in the room, yet they're all alone. That happens more often than most of the time, actually, more often than not. You go to a networking event. You're all supposed to be talking and networking for adults. Right?

And it could be a hundred people in the room, but there's really only about five because everybody's isolated themselves, and they're only giving plastic answers and, you know, not having real conversations. They're just having plastic conversations as I like to call it. How do we I'm sorry. I asked you a question, then I went on. So let me go back to that question.

我對這個話題非常熱衷，你們可能已經看得出來。所以，在我繼續下一個問題之前，請先回答這個問題。好的。那麼，讓我再重複一次這個問題。我想這個問題是，為什麼，你知道，現在這一代人，或者說現在的年輕一代，他們為什麼更容易陷入孤立？

Is that kind of a good way to put it? Yeah. That's another way to put it. Yep. Okay.

所以我認為你舉的人際互動之類的例子很重要，因為我覺得這裡面有兩個面向。首先，人性就是我們害怕彼此交談和聯繫，對吧，尤其是內向的人。我認識一些外向的人，他們會走進一個充滿從未見過的人的房間，和每個人閒聊。我覺得這對聽眾來說是一個糟糕的期望。對吧？

Because that personality type is is relatively rare. I think most people, are a little bit self conscious and they question themselves and their ability to talk to people and they think, oh, what what'll happen if I go up to this person and I ask the wrong question or I look like a fool or I they don't wanna talk to me. Right? So there is that aspect of human nature that is just indelible. Right?

All of us deal with that, not only me and you, but also, let's say, kids who are in middle school right now, kids who are in high school. And one of the other difficulties, right, when you are young, not that every age and generation doesn't have its own challenges, but when you are young, like, you just don't know a lot. Right? And so kids are mean, and you think about bullies in in grade school and whatnot in the fact that, like, there are so many things that for myself, right, I I dealt with mental health issues throughout grade school. I would have never and I never spoke about them about those issues to anybody at the time.

And that is really just a product of, like, being a kid and being scared. Right? And so Mhmm. As you get older and you learn more information, maybe you say to yourself, hey. I have actually learned that, for example, you know, one out of five people in The US deals with a mental health condition every year.

你開始把這些資訊堆積起來，然後對自己說，嘿，你知道嗎？也許處理這些事情並沒有那麼奇怪、不同或模糊。有了這樣的結論，也許你會更願意麵對你的焦慮，或是接受這種焦慮，然後說，你知道嗎？我現在可能很緊張，但我要去找人聊聊，或是我要跟別人談談這個棘手的話題。

Right? You just open up more, you become a little bit more willing to discuss things as you get older, I think, especially as you gain more information. So there's the piece of being a kid, being a human, and it being difficult to open up to other people, you know, being scared that you might get rejected or whatever it may be. I think to answer the next part of the the I I said there was two parts. Right?

So the first part is just human nature in general. The second part is the fact that, like, if you look at the technology that is being given to kids these days, right, It's a new phenomenon in the sense that, like, when I went to middle school and high school, we had AOL Instant Messenger. Right? And we had Yeah. Nintendo sixty four.

It was a very different kind of technology. And I'm sure the seeds were being planted, but it was a different kind of technology than exists today. And if you look at the the technology that is that is now in kids' hands, it's iPhones, it's mobile apps, it's social media, it's online gaming, and those and and also, I mean, I hate to say it, but, you know, pornography. There are a lot of things out there that are, you know, dangerous for kids. Right?

And I'm not not trying to sound like the, the unhip, you know, old guy or whatever. Right? But you like, if if I go back to being in sixth grade and I'm like, somebody gave me a cell phone with Instagram on it and I played, you know, shooter games online with my friends and I, you know, had access to all these, illicit no. Maybe not illicit, but, like, questionable websites. Right?

這有點像是把一種烈性物質餵給一個還沒有這種經驗的人。對吧？他們的大腦還沒發育。他們的額葉還遠遠沒有發育完全。所以，我想回到喬納森·海特的觀點，你知道，孩子就是他們的全部，對吧，他們的童年正在變成以手機為中心，或者以手機為主，而不是以玩耍或聯繫為主。

這是件很難的事。而且，你想想，好吧，如果你在上中學，就能接觸到手機、社群媒體等等，這些東西都是人為設計的，對吧？我是一名軟體開發者，我可以親自告訴你，我們設計行動應用程序，我相信其他軟體也一樣，你知道，你可以這麼說。我們設計這些程式要嘛上癮，要嘛至少能找到最吸引人或最有趣的體驗。然後我們把這些體驗提供給使用者。

Right? And so you take that to its to its extreme and you say, okay, on a, you know, on a social media app, we're gonna send you information that gets your emotions going and makes you wanna share content and whatnot. And sure, like, these platforms have businesses to run, and I get that. But you put that technology in the hands of an 11 year old, and all of a sudden we're talking scary territory here. So I will stop there, but I think those are the two main things, right, the human nature in general and gen and then just the fact that we're giving very powerful technologies to young kids and I would argue that they're probably not ready for them and that's no slight on them, it's like I don't even know if if necessarily every adult is ready for this stuff, and it's it's powerful.

所以我先停頓一下。我覺得你說得太好了。技術問題並非小事。但我想回過頭來跟各位聽眾說幾句。作為成年人，我們經常使用「社群媒體」這個詞。

但如果你是一個正在成長的青少年，社群媒體根本不存在。它只是媒體而已。我之所以這麼說，是因為我們這些30歲以上的人，是在社群媒體剛萌芽的時候長大的。所以對我們來說，它是一種獨立的媒體。但對青少年來說，他們只知道社群媒體就是一切。

除此之外別無其他。社群媒體就是世界。對於在當今社會成長的青少年來說，社群媒體就是一切。我之所以這麼說，是因為我認為我們大多數人不明白，作為成年人，我們大多數人甚至不明白，我們對此的看法與他們截然不同。社群媒體根本不存在。

Social media is a part of the existing world, period. They don't watch the local news. They don't even know who the no local news anchors are. They don't watch CNN unless they're watching it a clip of it on YouTube shorts or somebody's, you know, using it on TikTok or Instagram. They're there to them.

That is the world. What we used to consider television, what we used to consider go you know, the main source of getting our information about the world and our culture, that's not their source anymore. And it's around them twenty four seven. Information, information, information, but more than just information, infiltration. You know, here's here's our here's the stuff we want you to learn.

Here's how we want you to think. And this is what is they're constantly bombarded with as human beings across this Earth. We've always been bombarded with. Here's how we want you to think. I don't care what culture you're from.

What what country you're from. You know, what race you're from, blah blah blah. Every culture does that because that's part of human nature. But never in time before the past twenty years has it been the case where you're inundated with it literally twenty four seven. If you have any sort of electronic, you know, any sort of digital anything around you.

So I for and again, I'm mostly saying that to the adults listening. When you say social media, that's your term. That's not theirs. There is no social media to them. It's just media.

It's just, it's everything. Think about it. A two year old nowadays is growing up with a phone in their hand. I have literally watched two year olds scroll through social media, scroll through a phone better than a 30 year old. And I am not exaggerating.

I have physically seen that with my eyes. And I know it's not just as that, just that child. That's how we're growing up with. And I'm saying that because I really think it's extremely important to emphasize these facts to the adults listening. Because if they don't understand, I think many of them and and this is one of the reasons I started this podcast is there's a such a large disconnect between adults and our youth.

And, yes, they're growing up in a different world, but I think we we tend not to really fully recognize what a big freaking deal that is. And that plays into this conversation of why they're feeling so isolated because all they know is social media. And if they're not getting attention on that, oh, we're we're supposed to get attention from other humans around us. Believe it or not, that's actually foreign to a lot of them. The younger they are, the more foreign that is to them.

說了這麼多，布萊恩，你覺得解決方法是什麼？我現在要說的是我們的年輕人。對於那些在這個時代成長的人來說，他們只知道這些，這不是他們的錯。他們只知道這些。是我們這些比他們年長的人的錯，因為我們把這些垃圾塞到他們臉上。

所以，對於那些正在聽我講這些並開始意識到這一點的青少年來說，我可能太孤立了。他們能從現在的處境做些什麼呢？這是個好問題，我同意你剛才提到的所有觀點。這個問題很難回答，因為我們可以從很多不同的層面來看這個問題。對吧？

So first level being, what can an individual do? Next level being, maybe, what can a parent do? Next level being a school board or a district, and then next level being a state, a country, whatever. Right? I think starting at the lowest level, it's gonna it's gonna be kind of hard.

Right? Because as an 11 year old, and I'm making I'm just kinda pulling that number out of thin air. Mhmm. Could be 13, could be seven, whatever. The all consuming, all con all encompassing nature of social media as you so eloquently put a minute ago, that tends to blind you from other things that are going on in your world.

Right? So if if all you know is Snapchat and Instagram and Twitter and Facebook and I don't even know some of the apps that kids are on these days. If that is your life, then it might, you know, you kind of only know what you know and almost be people sometimes refer to, like, Plato's allegory of the cave. Right? And it's like, I guess I won't get into it all the way, but if people wanna look that up online, it's basically the notion of, like, what your reality looks like may not always be as it appears.

Right? And so for kids, their reality may be that social media is reality. It is the world, it is everything. The difficulty with that is that if all they're doing is, you know, air I'm gonna say air quotes, connecting with friends online, posting things online, watching videos, they might just be watching videos and consuming content of stuff that they enjoy or they care about, or maybe it scares them, but it, you know, grips them in some way. Mhmm.

他們可能很難跳出那個泡沫，跳出那個洞穴，然後說，哦，我現在意識到社群媒體不是萬能的，我需要偶爾離開社群媒體。所以這個問題很難具體回答，因為每個人的情況都不一樣，你需要一些，你知道的，對這個現實的洞察，要么來自父母，要么來自我們很幸運的孩子，比如看了一個視頻，讓他們稍微清醒一下，對吧？但到了一定的時候，必須要有一些意識，例如，讓那個孩子說，你看，我的生活方式可能是有害的。對吧？

我可能不應該一直使用這些應用程式。所以我認為首先，我給的第一個建議是，比如說，如果有人正在聽這個播客，而他正在經歷現實的滲透，那麼有人會說，嘿，我已經被這個新現實和社交媒體的危險喚醒了，那麼我對那些正在聽的人的建議是，嘿，你可能整天都在使用你的設備，無論是在學校以外，還是在學校裡待一會兒。給自己一小時、兩小時、三小時。是的。每天做一些與科技無關的事情。也許是和你的兄弟姐妹玩，也許是去鄰居家，如果你知道一個同學住在那裡，敲門說，嘿，你想騎自行車嗎？

你想在車道上投籃嗎？不管是什麼都行。回到我在談話開始時提到的觀點，例如玩耍的重要性，培養解讀他人肢體語言和理解對話細微差別的能力的重要性，這些能力只有透過真實的面對面、現實世界的對話和人際關係才能獲得。所以我們需要孩子認真傾聽，重新與現實世界建立聯繫，找到在現實世界中培養真實關係的方法。我想說的下一個層面是，如果家長們認真傾聽，那麼你們可以做幾件事。

You could maybe put on so there is on some of the mobile devices, right, there are parental controls. So you can I I don't use them because I don't have kids, but you can you can specify what kids can and can't do on the device and maybe set, you know, timers and limits and stuff like that? Consider maybe using those controls so that way, hey. If your kid wants to go online and you're okay with it and all his friends are online and he feels like if he won't go if he doesn't go online, he'll be bullied, then then maybe there's an argument for that. But make sure that it doesn't become all consuming where, you know, you send him to his room and you think he's going to bed and he's on his iPad for like four hours.

Right. And doing things that, yeah, that's true. You wouldn't want him to do so. Parental controls and then also like get involved right at the school board level where, you know, talk to your teachers, see what's happening in the classroom, and try to instill, you know, an an understanding with some of the administrators that, like, there's a problem here and we need to figure this out. I think about it because I'm like, I don't have kids.

我希望在人生的某個階段有個孩子，但我有點擔心，例如，這一切會如何發展？身為父母我該怎麼辦？我不知道。對吧？因為爭論是可以的。你可能會說，我的孩子要到16歲才能擁有手機。

Right now that sounds like a decent idea because you're like, well, then they will not be subjected to all these scary forces online and they will build relationships and know what the real world is like. However, in practice, when you get down to it, things are not always that simple, right? Maybe the kid comes home at 13 or 11 and says, mom, dad, everybody picks on me because everybody else is online and I'm not online. And they started a group chat called, like, everybody in the classroom except for Brian, and they're all making fun of Brian in in the group chat. Right?

So there's a lot of nuances here and there's a lot of difficulty. What I would say is, like, it's a balance of, like, implementing some strategies on your own, but then also thinking about the culture and kind of reading that. Right? Where, like, you don't if the goal like, the goal is to have healthy, happy kids, whether they're your own or just the generation in general. And so if we like, that if that is the goal, then we really need to make sure that we are kinda getting a lay of the land and not just implementing certain things.

For example, to say, like, hey. My kid's not gonna get a cell phone till sixteen eighteen. That could have unintended unintended negative consequences. So we gotta think about all those possible ramifications and then just make the best decisions we can knowing that it's it's a really difficult subject. I wanna add to that.

我認為，總結你所說的很多內容，關鍵字就是“平衡”，這也是我一直在強調的。也就是說，你不必確保給予他們自由，但你也不應該給他們太多自由，以至於他們手裡拿著手機就掉下懸崖。你也不應該管得太嚴，以至於他們最終會發瘋，因為這就是我們對孩子太嚴格時會發生的情況。他們總是能找到辦法，因為有志者事竟成。你可以限制他們在手機上做任何你想做的事情，但這沒關係。

They're gonna borrow Kendra's phone, and she'll let her do it. You know? There's just ways around it. They'll they'll there's just so so so so many ways around it. So I think the key thing is, is, to the teenagers listening.

You it's you were talking about and you were the one that has to decide your future. Because no matter what we do, you're the one who's got to live it, not us. And if you really wanna be better than your peers, one up from your peers, and I said it just like that. If you wanna be one up from your peers, then you are the one that's gonna have to make the decision right now that you want to be better connected to humanity than they are. And so what that looks like is you have to make a make a decision that, you know what?

Tuesday from three to four. I'm turning my phone off and I'm taking my little brother to the park. We're going to play ball or Saturdays from six to seven. I'm going to play Uno with my little sister and everything gets turned off. So the problem isn't that you don't take your little brother to the park or play Uno with your sister.

問題在於，你不關手機，它就會在你做其他事情的時候控制你。所以，如果你身為一個年輕人，真的想做出這樣的決定：比同儕更勝一籌，真正擁有人際交往，這也意味著你在某些領域，尤其是在職業領域，可能會比他們走得更遠。你必須做出這樣的決定，你知道嗎？我要……我要休息一會兒。我告訴你，我看到很多人常常這樣做。

Adults adults do this, but this is not an age thing. So you could do the same thing as a teenager and get the exact same results. It it it really doesn't matter. So I've seen adults who are like, you know what? I'm staying off social media for a day, for three days, whatever their time frame is.

他們每次回來都會說，天哪！感覺神清氣爽。就像洗了個澡一樣。你知道，你把周圍那些垃圾都洗乾淨了。媒體上有很多精彩的東西。

There really is, but there's just as much garbage. There's just as many things making you feel insecure. There's just as many things making you feel unaccomplished, making you feel less than, etcetera, etcetera. So if you're a teenager, listen, I really want to emphasize it really at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what of, what us adults do, what we try to do. It's up to you.

If you really want to be better than your peers, you want to be one up. And I'm I'm wording it like that because I know that's that's the wording that'll reach you. Then you've got to make a change and do something different than everybody else is doing. Stop falling in line and just be another piece of cattle like everybody else because you're gonna end up a robot like them too. If you wanna be one up, hey.

Start making differences and changes now. Doesn't matter what everybody else does or doesn't accept or doesn't doesn't like it. I promise you they'll start to respect you for it after a while because they don't have the guts to do it. And that ends my speech there. Now I just had I just had to say that.

Now, Brian, I wanna start wrapping this up, and I want I want the audience to understand a little bit more about you and what you do, because I think you're very good at, you know, the things that you focus on. Brian focuses on a lot of a lot of other subjects. We, wanted to talk about isolation today, but if you could tell the audience a little bit more about what you do and how they could find you. For sure. So I am a mental health advocate, an author, a blogger, all those good things.

Right? My work focuses on anxiety and depression. So I have a book on anxiety, a book on depression, talking about managing both diseases or conditions, possibly overcoming them. And one of the reasons why I was so intrigued by this conversation topic of isolation is that depression and isolation can go hand in hand. And so I've done some research and some writing, into both of those topics, and it's something that's important and near and dear to my heart.

If folks want to get in touch with me or find some of my work, you can go to getoutofyourhead.com. So there's no dashes, no spaces in that, it's all kind of one word, getoutofyourhead.com. The place where I'm active most on social media or media would be Instagram at the moment. So the account there for the, the writing is get out of your head as the as the the handle, if you will, all all one word as well, no dashes, no spaces there. You know, it's it's always great even though it's great to have these conversations even though the topics are scary and unsettling and have, you know, real world and possibly large ramifications, but, you know, I have these conversations with folks like yourself and I like talking about this stuff because mental health is really important to me.

這是我一生中一直在掙扎的事情。在我的心理健康取得一些進展後，我感覺自己對這個主題充滿熱情，想要與他人分享我的心得。這就是為什麼我會繼續進行這樣的對話，因為我知道有很多人正在為此掙扎。我想告訴大家，掙扎是正常的，說實話，這很正常，很自然。這是人類生存狀態的一部分。

嗯嗯。我只是盡力傳播訊息，希望聽到一些聽眾的聲音。布萊恩，非常感謝你的到來。對於在場的聽眾，我希望你們能感受到他的真誠。我只能從我們私下的談話中來告訴你。

This man is very sincere. It's one of the reasons I had him on. I don't like people that can talk about concepts, but that's all they can do is talk about a concept, and don't come a place from a place of actually really understanding it, and and you do. So, if you wanna talk to somebody who's genuinely sincere about helping other people and helping you, Brian's one of those. And I and, unfortunately, I think that they're more rare than they should be, but, the sincerity is something that I really appreciate about you.

And thank you once again for coming on and having this conversation. And thanks for having me, Fatima. It was a pleasure. And now for a mind shifting moment. I'm looking to talk to a particular person out there today.

Are you feeling lonely? Did it ever occur to you that maybe one of the reasons you're feeling lonely is because you keep yourself too isolated? Sometimes we can be have all these people around us, yet we feel so alone. And we're not physically alone, but we are alone because we have chosen to mentally isolate ourselves. Is that you?

Do you feel totally alone amongst all these humans? I want you to know you don't have to be. What you need to do is find the right person or people to actually begin to open up to and allow somebody in so that you don't have to feel so alone anymore. That loneliness is the foundation for depression. It is the gateway to so many, many, many other things.

I just want you to think about that. Thank you for listening to mind shift power podcast. Please like, and subscribe to my YouTube channel at the mind shifter. If you have any comments, topic suggestions, or would like to be a guest on the show, please visit FatimaBay.com/podcast. Remember, there's power in shifting your thinking.

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