Fatima Bey: 0:01

歡迎收聽 MindShift Power Podcast，這是唯一一個專注於青少年的國際播客，匯聚了來自世界各地的年輕人的聲音和觀點。準備好探討當今青少年關注的、塑造未來世界的議題吧。我是主持人，Fatima Bey，MindShifter，歡迎大家。今天我們邀請到了 Tamsyn Brewster。她是一位自信教練，住在英國布里斯托。她專注於研究身體形象及其如何影響我們在不同人生階段的自信。這與今天的主題非常相關。

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：0:42

So how are you doing today, tamsyn? I'm good, thank you, thanks for having me. Did I say your last name correct? Yes, you did. I'm really impressed.

Fatima Bey: 0:51

I'm impressed with me too. Thank you, all right, so we're going to talk about young confidence versus old insecurities. By the time this episode comes out, it might not be named that, but that's the topic, so let's first start off by Tamsyn.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：1:09

跟我們說說你是做什麼的？我為商界女性開設了一些項目，幫助她們建立堅如磐石的自信，讓她們能夠在不改變自我的情況下展現出專家風範。我們很多人認為，為了融入社會，我們必須縮小自己的尺寸，必須變得更漂亮、更年輕，等等，執著於這種美感觀念才能獲得成功。而我幫助人們認識到，事實並非如此。

法蒂瑪先生：1:35

Love that you do that, because we are on the exact same page when it comes to that. And so who exactly do you serve with your services?

Tamsin Broster: 1:43

所以我傾向於與那些可能是教練或某種服務提供者的女性合作。但我也與許多有事業心、處於圍絕經期的女性合作。她們正處於人生的這個階段，開始懷疑自己，看到自己的身體改變。她們不喜歡自己的變化，覺得身體不符合自己理想的狀態，她們的焦慮和自信心受到打擊。所以我通常與這類人合作，因為我受過更年期的培訓，也是身體形象的專家。所以，根據人們的需求，我會將這兩方面都考慮進去。所以，你知道，人們與我合作的方式有很多種，但我會根據他們正在經歷的情況，傾向於他們所需要的。

Fatima Bey: 2:26

好吧，你和年長的女性一起工作，而這個節目是針對青少年的，那麼你為什麼會出現在這裡呢？

Tamsin Broster: 2:33

Because when I saw your we met inside a podcasting group and when I saw what you were saying, I, I am a really I'm so passionate about breaking generational cycles. I am a really I'm so passionate about breaking generational cycles. And when things stop with us and I've seen this firsthand with my own daughter she's 10. I've seen this firsthand. By the time I was like six, I thought my body was completely wrong, that it needed to be smaller. That was the message that I got from my grandmothers my mother constantly dieting, picking apart their bodies. And my daughter is not like that at all, because I have brought her up in a very different way, because I ended that cycle with myself and I have seen firsthand that that works.

Tamsin Broster: 3:15

Because if anyone says to my daughter, oh my gosh, you look amazing, she's like I know right, whereas I would have been like I look awful, you know, I would have berated myself and I would have really picked apart everything and thought that I just wasn't good enough, especially in sports.

Tamsin Broster: 3:30

I gave up sports quite young because I loved gymnastics and I love ballet, but I knew that my body was bigger than the other girls and I was very conscious of that really young age, six or seven and she just doesn't have that kind of same outlook and I honestly believe it's because I've ended that cycle. Yes, she's going to be exposed to it in other ways as she grows up and we can navigate that and we have navigated that. We have navigated those conversations. But it's very different. When I would have gone to my mom and said I think my body's too big, she would have gone oh okay, if you feel that way, let's go on a diet, whereas I would not say that to my child. That's not the conversation we have. We have a conversation about diversity and how different bodies are all different and how there's strength in our bodies and how we can live in the only place we get to call home forever in a peaceful way.

Fatima Bey: 4:20

現在，當你和我談話的時候。我們做這個節目的原因之一，以及你來這裡的原因，很簡單，因為你和年長的女性一起工作。

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：4:29

Yeah.

Fatima Bey: 4:29

Their insecurities. You see a lot of insecurities in older women which you just you know were talking about. Where do those insecurities start?

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：4:40

Again. I think they start from when we grow up. We are socialized with media, with, now, social media, but you know, we had magazines, we had TV programs, movies. The diet industry is worth billions of pounds. The beauty and diet industry is worth billions of pounds. We spend more on beauty than we do on education and it's targeted mostly at women.

Tamsin Broster: 5:03

90% of beauty advertising and diet culture is marketed towards women and I think that's by design, because it keeps us really preoccupied with other things that are not about challenging anything that's happening to us or around us. It keeps us really busy and preoccupied, which is really really convenient for the patriarchy, and I think this is where it comes from. We watched our mothers go through all these different diets and we've repeated those cycles and it's really hard to get out of because it's not as simple as us just saying, well, we're not going to do that, we're going to do differently. Because if you're in a body that is still not accepted by society, where you maybe go to the doctor and they say, oh yeah, you'll fix your health issues if you just lose weight and maybe that is or isn't the case, but it's always the first point of call for anybody who's in a slightly larger body to be told that everything will be different if they were just thinner. And it's not actually true. We can be in our. We can be. I'm healthier now in my bigger body than I ever was in my smaller body for a million different reasons.

Tamsin Broster: 6:08

But this is the reason why it's not very easy to come out of and why I help people kind of navigate that in what I call the wild out there in the world, because it's easy to sit there and say, oh, you should love your body. But if every time you go to your doctor or your healthcare provider you're told that you should be smaller, time you go to your doctor or your healthcare provider you're told that you should be smaller, or you go and visit your family and you've got parents who are saying you should be shrinking, you should be smaller, you should look after your health, and you have all of that messaging constantly. You're constantly, you're having to deal with that on a regular basis. That's hard to do. It's hard to love yourself when people other people don't necessarily see you in the same way that you're trying to see yourself.

Fatima Bey: 6:46

And it can be challenging. I want to really point out a deeper dive into something that Tamsyn has been saying. She deals with a lot of older women with insecurity issues. Young women listen to me right now, your insecurity issues that you're dealing with right now, that you know that you have, they're not going to just end by themselves. You may be one of these women who were in their 50s, 60s and 70s who still feel like an insecure teenage, 13-year-old girl. I see it all the time when I deal with mothers of the brides. You all have heard me talk about being a bridal seamstress for years. This is something that Tamsen and I have talked about. When I look at mother of the brides, I see exactly what she sees Women who are just as insecure as the prom girls that I deal with, who were 16, 17, and 18.

Fatima Bey: 7:39

但是，身為女性，我們必須從現在開始建立自信。方法有很多，但你至少要嘗試。你必須付出努力，就像塔姆森剛才說的，這可能很難，也取決於你的文化，因為我們談論的是一個普遍的問題，對吧，塔姆森？是的，是的，你在英國，我在美國，但同樣的話題也可能適用於辛巴威、日本、韓國或瓜地馬拉的女孩。這是全世界女性共同面臨的問題。這是一個普遍的問題，我很高興你和我一樣，熱衷於幫助女性提升自我，建立自信。但我希望觀眾知道，我特意邀請塔姆森來做這個節目，是因為她看到瞭如果現在不建立自信會是什麼樣子，以及這會如何影響你的生活。那麼，塔姆森，如果女孩們現在就開始建立自信，那會是什麼樣子呢？實際上會是什麼樣子？

Tamsin Broster: 8:46

Yeah, that's a really good question. I think for young girls, what it looks like is they are advocating for themselves, because when you are outsourcing and this is what I say to older women that I work with you're outsourcing yourself. If you are doubting that your body is not good enough or you don't look the right way, it's quite likely that you are going to be expecting somebody else or some organization or some company to tell you how to eat, how to move your body, how to do this stuff that seeps into everyday life. It will be the reason that you accept the relationship that is not good for you. It's the reason that you put up with the body shaming comments from maybe your mom, your dad, your aunties, your uncles, whatever. And it's the reason you might not call out something because you're scared to do so, because other people's opinions have been driving your behavior all this time.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：9:38

And I think, for young women, when they start to not buy into this stuff, you're making a really big stand about against something that has, for you know, forever controlled women. You know this whole idea that we need to meet this certain set of values and certain set of um like rules across, like you say, across the world. It's all different in different cultures, but there's always these rules. But you're making that choice to say, actually, this is where that ends. I'm going to put my money and my you know, my brain and my energy and into something that's more meaningful, and I think that's when we will. We're coming home to ourselves, so we're, you know, when you know the right choice in your heart because you'll be able to believe it. But when you're constantly thinking that you can't make good decisions because you don't trust yourself, it's, it's a very it's. It's very difficult to kind of link that with food, but I see it all the time.

Tamsin Broster: 10:33

The second, that women start trusting themselves and their own decisions around food and their body and how they move their body and how that what really lights them up, it seeps into every. It's like a gateway, like it just like opens up, like, oh, hang on a minute. I don't think that friendship is doing me any good. Oh, hold on a minute. I don't think I really want this particular job for the rest of my life. Maybe I do want to go and explore something else. And it gives you that agency over yourself. That's, and I think we'll get there earlier.

Tamsin Broster: 11:01

I was in my forties when I began to have agency over my body. Maybe it's okay not to weigh myself three times a day, maybe I don't have to weigh myself at all. You know, those things helped me to make decisions on other things, bigger things, what I want to do with my life, how I want my world to be, how much of a you know what kind of person I want to be, the decisions I make about my business, my career, bringing up my children, all of those things aren't dictated by other people and there's a lot of privilege in that. That I'll acknowledge straight away. But this is where we've got to be coming home to ourselves, to have that agency as much as possible.

Fatima Bey: 11:42

沒錯。我想指出你剛才說的幾點。我只是想複述一下。你剛才說的最重要的一點，我問你，當年輕女性開始有自信時，她們會是什麼樣子？你開始為自己挺身而出，開始為自己發聲，但基本上，你開始為自己挺身而出，開始為自己發聲，開始設定界線和標準。這些界線和標準都是一樣的，當你開始有自信時，你就會開始為自己挺身而出。這是最早的證據之一，因為我們可以說我們是這個，我們是那個，但證據在哪裡？告訴我這是怎麼回事。不要只是告訴我這是真的，不要只是說說而已，而是要告訴我這是怎麼回事。當我們開始對自己有信心時，我們確實會為自己挺身而出，設定標準。而當我們這樣做的時候，就意味著不是每個人都會喜歡它，對吧？

Tamsin Broster: 12:36

是的，是的，人們不會喜歡的，界線本身就很難界定，我認為人們最難的就是如何維持這些界線。我以前有很多客戶，家人對他們的體型和外觀施加了很大的壓力，他們又給自己設下這些界限，比如說，我不想每次你打電話給我，或者每次我們家庭聚會時，我的身材都成為話題。要保持這些界線真的很難。我把它們放在自己身上，你知道，突然之間改變它們很難，特別是當你以前是一個人的時候，如果我們在這裡談論體型，我只是以此為例，如果你一直是這樣的人，好吧，我在節食，我要改變我的生活，我要變瘦，我要做所有這些事情，而你一直像我一樣公開分享，就像我每次節食一樣，每次我都會告訴每個人，我會按照我認為社會希望我的方式移動我的身體，以達到我想要的標準，他們希望我這樣做。

Tamsin Broster: 13:36

I was always sharing and telling everyone and I told myself it was accountability when I did that full flip and did a full 180 on that kind of stuff and I actually don't want to share that. There's nothing to do with anybody else. How I move my body is for me and me personally to enjoy my body in the way that I want to. I don't have to share with anybody how healthy or unhealthy I am being according to society's standards. I no longer have to share that.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：14:02

人們必須習慣這一點，他們必須意識到你不再是那個交換食譜的人，你不再喜歡談論同樣的事情，生活中任何改變都是如此。當你設定了界限，人們認識你之後，你的身分就變得清晰明確了。他們仍然會用他們為你設定的那個身分來思考你，他們需要時間來適應。所以，界限和堅定地堅守界限至關重要。你不能在這個問題上含糊其辭。你必須非常清楚自己是誰，你支持什麼，以及你不想談論什麼，並且你必須真正遵守界線。如果你設定了界限，有人越界了，你必須堅持下去，否則他們會認為它很靈活，對你來說並不重要。

法蒂瑪先生：14:51

I always. A quote of mine that I made up years ago is people will always cross a line they do not see, and I think it's so important to set those boundaries. And I think it's so important to set those boundaries, but if you verbally set them but you don't follow through with them, otherwise, well then that's a line they cannot see, because now you've made it wobbly and blurry. And when we are growing and when we are maturing, but especially when we're growing in confidence, we are going to change ourselves, which means we're no longer going to accept some of the things we accepted before, the little snide comments that we just kind of cowered under before. We're not gonna put up with that anymore. And you know what, ladies, that means you might have to switch friends, your friends roster might actually change, and just because someone's related to you by blood doesn't mean they need to be on your close friends list either. It is okay to move around whatever you need to move around so that you have people around you who are actually supportive, right.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：15:50

太對了。太對了，沒錯，這是我和客戶的親身經歷。但你現在想到這些，心裡會想，天哪，我不想改變我的朋友，因為我也有同樣的感受。但實際上，你會發現，你為更美好的事物騰出了空間。

Tamsin Broster: 16:08

That really really meet you where you are and you have deeper conversations that are so enriching to your life. You didn't even know you needed them, but you've got to go through that space, that place. But it's important to understand that your boundaries can change and that your boundaries can develop with you.

法蒂瑪先生：16:26

Yes, and if you have people who are mature enough and care about you enough, they'll respect your new boundaries and they'll keep chugging along with you. And that happens too. But I say that because sometimes people are like, yes, I'm going to put up new boundaries, I'm going to change, but they to be or who you've been, and they might not like change, because they just want to keep the same access to you or keep doing the same things, and you're not with that anymore, and so you move on. What I want to ask you also, tamsen, is we talk about support, and support is actually really important, but I'm also fully aware that there are a lot of young women in the world who don't have support.

Fatima Bey: 17:13

That's the reality. Their family sucks. No one actually is supportive of each other. They don't communicate, they don't show that they care, they don't show anything. All they do is insult you and walk away. That's a reality for some people. It shouldn't be, but I don't like talking about ideals. I like talking about reality, because that's where people live. So for a woman who's in that situation and she's like I need to build confidence. You're right. What does she do?

Tamsin Broster: 17:40

這又是關於回歸自我。你說得完全正確，並非每個人都擁有這種神奇的支持網絡，這就是為什麼我在一開始就說，我所談論的一些事情背後往往隱藏著巨大的特權。但如果你沒有這種特權，——這的確是一個非常好的觀點，也是很多女性面臨的一個現實——那麼，關鍵在於你如何管理自己的神經系統，如何管理你的身體，如何應對發生在你身上的事情、別人對你說的話、以及那些與你的感受相悖或讓你感覺不好的事情。你知道，提醒自己，別人對你說了什麼，並不代表它就是真的。而這正是你可能會產生這些想法的原因。

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：18:26

Like we know that our inner critic and that nagging voice in our head that tells us we're not good enough is actually based on other people's perceptions and the things that has been said to us all of our lives. And so many women will get into their sort of forties and fifties They've got this like nagging voice and they don't know where it comes from. When we really kind of drill down to it, it's like actually they heard that as a child that was said to them growing up and they've kind of reinforced it and it sounds like their own voice, but it's not their own voice and it's about separating that. When you watch that coming up, when you hear that voice coming up when that person's not with you but you're, you know, on your own or you're in a situation where, um, your self-doubt creeps in, it's remembering that that thought is not fact and that you know, and actually I like to call it like my shitty committee, like if that committee in your brain is gathering and it's having a little moment where it's like, yeah, not good enough, I like to argue back and I'm like, yeah, you know what, I hear what you're saying, because your inner critic really likes to be heard.

Tamsin Broster: 19:26

But then go back to it and say, but I don't agree with you, I don't agree with you, that I'm not good enough, and like, actually, you know, almost argue it like it's separate, separate it from yourself. It's not you, it's other people's opinions. And yeah, really you know. But it's always a good idea to just say I hear what you're saying because it likes to be heard, but I know you don't have to agree with it.

Fatima Bey: 19:56

That is actually one of my, my, my coaching tools. Yeah, having people talk back to the bitch in your head, oh yeah, and I have them curse them out or it depends on the person, because everybody's not the same but but they have them talk back to those negative thoughts and um, and you know, and I give them other tools along with it. It's not just that, but but that is a piece of it, and you're exactly right because it does work if you want to say, because every time you do that, you're not only stopping the voice, but you are actually building your own confidence, because you can speak back the positive things in rebuttal to it, and that matters.

Fatima Bey: 20:41

Do you also think for young women? Because I do believe that we as human beings need other humans, whether we like it or not, whether we want to believe it or not, and we all need some kind of support. I don't care who you are, I don't care how strong you are. We all need some kind of support. Do you think online communities are a good idea for a young woman who's got literally no support, has no humans that she knows she can talk to or go to? Is it a good idea for her to find an online community where she might find some support.

Tamsin Broster: 21:06

Yes, if that community feels safe to you. Yes, 100%. I have a lot of support around me and I still use online communities for, again, very specific things. I run an online community for menopause and having that safe space where people can come and ask the questions that they can't talk about with their partner, they can't talk about with their friends maybe they're not going through the same things but it's about finding the right places where you feel that you can actually be heard and supported in the right way, whatever that might be to you, and sometimes it's like about kissing a few frogs and getting it right or getting it wrong. Don't be afraid to really use that. But I really think online communities are a great way of connecting with people all over the world to sort of support yourself. A great way of connecting with people all over the world to sort of support yourself 100%. If you've got access to that, definitely I think that's a brilliant idea.

法蒂瑪先生：22:00

The reason I mentioned that is that most people in the world do have access to that one form or another, even if it's just a Facebook group. You know, Facebook is not that popular anymore, but it is in certain parts of the world and it's still one of the best places for groups.

Tamsin Broster: 22:09

是的，我同意你的說法。哪裡最適合團體聚餐？

法蒂瑪先生：22:11

Yeah, I would say it's one of the best places for groups.

法蒂瑪先生：22:13

所以，你總是能找到你喜歡的、你能找到的群組，我現在就和那裡的年輕女性交流。你可以找到和你相似、認同你的觀點、有共同點，或只是支持你的群組。你確實需要去尋找他們。你需要瀏覽他們的評論，看看大家在討論什麼。但即使你住在第三世界國家，數據有限，Facebook 群組通常不會佔用那麼多數據。這也是我所考慮的。

Fatima Bey: 22:48

What about people who aren't in Western countries like ours? What about somebody who's in the mountains of Mongolia and she's got limited data but she really wants to reach out to somebody who might understand her, get that signal and get over there? But it's an easy way to do it if you don't have the people around you that you need, and there's always a way to find support. Sometimes, when we think there isn't, we don't try, and then that's why we don't get it. So what do you have to say to young women in the world? I want you to talk to teenage girls all around the world right now.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：23:30

What would you like to say to them I want you to know and understand fully, like literally take a minute right now and just drop into your body, and I want you to understand, like to welcome yourself home, because we live so disconnected from our bodies.

Tamsin Broster: 23:49

We are so kind of in our head thinking about what we're going to do, what we're going to change what we should be, how we're going to make sure that it's human nature to stay part of the pack and to be included and to be the same as everybody else, because we want to make sure that we are safe. But I want you to regularly drop into your body and welcome yourself home, because this is the only home you will ever have and how you treat that home is going to be how great your life is. If you can just treat your body. Don't worry about what it looks like, not worrying about not. Everybody's body is going to feel the same. We're all born with different kind of. We're all born into like different bodies with different things. But it's just coming home to yourself and just recognizing that that is the place you get to live for your whole life. You're only going to get that one body.

Fatima Bey: 24:40

That is a very good way of looking at it, instead of trying to escape from it or doing every kind of plastic surgery or other alterations to try to make it look like something or not. It doesn't take care of the inside, which is who's really suffering.

Tamsin Broster: 24:56

So, tamsyn how do they find you? I tend to hang out on Instagram and on LinkedIn. I have a website. You can find me. Just Google my name, Tamsyn Broster. It's quite unique, so I tend to come up in the search.

Fatima Bey: 25:12

It will also be linked in the show notes.

Tamsin Broster: 25:14

Yeah, sure, yeah. That's how you find me. That's where I hang out.

Fatima Bey: 25:18

So I want to let you all know that Tamsyn only gave you a tiny, tiny, tiny, teeny, tiny, tiny drop of all that she's capable of doing and her full knowledge and what she does for other people. You only heard a teeny, teeny, tiny drop. So if you want to hear more, she has a lot more to say and she does dive into this stuff a lot deeper. We just don't. You know, we'd have to be here for about 45 years for her to expand on it all. So she does really truly go a lot deeper into these topics. So I strongly advise that you go take a look at her website and get to know her a little better. Follow her on social media, but she's got a lot to say that, I think, would really that would really help most of the women in the world if you want to take the time to listen. So thank you again, tamsen, for coming on.

塔姆辛·布羅斯特：26:06

Thank you for having me.

法蒂瑪先生：26:08

And now for a mind shifting moment. Young women, old women, all women, building our self-confidence is not easy. It's easy for us to tell you that you need to be stronger, that you need to be more positive, that you need to believe in yourself stronger, that you need to be more positive, that you need to believe in yourself. Although all that's true, it's easy for us to say we do understand it's not so much easy to do, but it can be done. Both Tamsen and I care very deeply about you, young women, old women, old women, all women. We want to see you win. We want to see you win.

Fatima Bey: 26:57

Start that journey today of trying to build your self-confidence. It is not magical, it is not automatic. You just have to start trying. You can start trying today, by reaching out to Tamsen or reaching out to myself or someone near you, to start building yourself and believing in yourself. It will change your entire life. Every single area of your life right now is less than being held back because of your lack of confidence. Start working on that today. We want to see you win. We really want to see you win. Thank you for listening. Be sure to follow or subscribe to MindShift Power Podcast on any of our worldwide platforms, so you, too, can be a part of the conversation that's changing young lives everywhere. And always remember there's power in shifting your thinking.