Welcome And Guest Introduction

Fatima Bey 0:02

MindShift Power Podcast This is Mind Shift Power Podcast, the number one critically acclaimed podcast where we have raw, unfiltered conversations that shape tomorrow. I'm your host, Fatima Bay, the Mind Shifter. And welcome everyone. Today we have with us Jojo Campbell. She is out of Pennsylvania in the USA. She is the host of No Hard Feelings kinda podcast. And she has a personal story to share. So how are you doing today, Jojo? I am doing great. Thank you so much for having me. I'm really glad to have you on. So I like to dive right

Jojo’s Background And Key Relationships

Fatima Bey 0:46

into it. So let's just go right into tell us your story. Okay.

JoJo Campbell 0:52

Um I so just to kind of give you just a quick little, you know, who's who kind of thing. Um I have two brothers, two older brothers. Um, their names are Jimmy and Ron. And this story really centers around my brother Jimmy. Um my brother Ron and I were very close, but he um later in life he died by suicide. Um so this really, plus he and I did not grow up in the same house. Um, so, but my brother Jimmy and I did. So um we grew up, he's 10 years older than me, you know, so we were never really like close, close just because of the age gap there. Um, but he had, you know, a group of friends that hung out at the house all the time when I was a kid. And one of those friends was his best friend, and his name's Chris. And so, really, just as I grew up, Chris kind of was like sort of like an extra older brother, um, just the way I sort of viewed him as. And when they, you know, graduated high school, um, they both joined the National Guard. So they kind of kept really close just because they had they were in the same um, I don't know if it's called like a platoon or what, but they were in the same setting. And so after I graduated high school and I moved out, so I actually left home when I was 17. And uh it was right after September 11th, um they both

After Deployment The Party Night

JoJo Campbell 2:32

Jimmy and Chris both were deployed for a year. And they were deployed at the same place, to the to the same place. Um, when they came back, I was living in my own apartment. Um, and it just so happened I lived in the same town, really not far at all from where Chris lived. So he gets my number and calls, and you know, we just talk. And I I invite him over because I was having friends over with also my boyfriend at the time, and we would, you know, play cards and drink and all that. So I invited Chris to come over. I hadn't seen him in years. And um, so he comes over and he's really kind of the life of the party. That was always his personality, you know, very charming and charismatic and funny. And um towards the end of the night, now I had this habit of, you know, whenever I had had a little too much to drink, um, I just kind of would go to bed and not like still anybody. And I don't know why I would do that. But my my group of friends and my boyfriend, they were all great and they would always like kind of clock up and you know, do whatever needed to be done. And so I did this this night, and I'm in my room, and um, a little bit later, I hear the door open, and I assume that it's my boyfriend. Um and then you know how when when you love somebody, you you just sort of know their presence uh and you know their touch, and you, you know, you just sort of can know that when they're there. And right away I kind of felt like something was off.

First Assault And Immediate Fallout

JoJo Campbell 4:20

This was not, something wasn't right. And before I really, you know, could even figure out what's going on, because I had a lot to drink that night, um, there was a hand, a hand down my pants. I'll just be blunt about it. It was a hand down my pants and up my shirt and and everything. And I I just jumped up and I walked out of the room. And as I come out of my bedroom, I see my boyfriend down at the other end of the hall coming to like look for me. So immediately I realized that was not who was in my room. And so I turn around and I see Chris coming out of my bedroom. And all within seconds, at this point, you know, it's he's he's got somewhere to be. He's oh, I've got to get going. It was so nice to meet everybody, and he's boom, out the door. And I'm kind of just standing there really dumbfounded and confused, and you know, but I tell my boyfriend what happened, and you know, we're uh everybody's mad, everybody's upset. And so I realized that I have to tell my brother the ne, you know, the next day. So um now this is a kind of a two-part um assault. We'll we'll put it this way, because there is a a much worse assault that happens. Um but long story short, I go to my brother, Jimmy, and I tell him what happened, exactly what happened. And I don't know what I expected. I don't I I I just expected some kind of emotional reaction. Um, but I really just got, well, I'll talk to him about it. And that was all he said. So I said, okay. So then a couple of days go by and I hadn't heard anything. So I I call him and I ask him about it. And I said, you know, have you talked to Chris? And he says, Yeah, well, he says he he didn't do that. Well, of course he's gonna say that he didn't do that. And my brother just seemed perfectly content with that answer. And I I don't remember exactly now like what I said or or what happened, but I I remember, I know I kind of pushed for him to like bring it up again to him. And he did. And now the second time Chris admitted it and he told my brother, yeah, which was really surprising. Um, I did not see that coming. And but of course, he wrapped it in a bunch of excuses about how much he had had to drink that night. Oh, of course. Right, exactly. Um, you know, he would never do anything to intentionally hurt me. He loved me like a sister, yada, yada, yada. So um my brother accepted that apology or whatever it was, um, I guess on my behalf, but I did not accept it. And um just really there was nothing, I guess, from that point where nothing really came of it because Chris wasn't someone I saw on a daily basis, or, you know, like I had no intention of ever seeing him again. So um I just kind of let it go. I let it be. I'm I'm young and you know, I don't know what my thought process was exactly. But um

Forced Apology And False Peace

JoJo Campbell 7:55

very shortly after my brother um he ends up moving in with Chris. Um they get a place together um where it's actually him, my brother, Chris, and Chris's sister. And he kind of sets it up to where he invites me out one night and doesn't tell me that Chris is gonna be there so that he wanted he basically wanted me to get there so that Chris could apologize to me. And um the the whole purpose around it was that now that they were all living together, you know, my brother didn't want me to feel like I could never come over. And he just, you know, thought that maybe if Chris apologized to my face publicly, that that would help the situation. So I, you know, felt a little bit backed into a corner about it, but at the same time, I was a very forgiving person too. And I thought, well, maybe that is really the case. It was just, you know, he was really drunk and didn't know what he was doing. So I took his word at it at that point. So I forgave, and they would have parties at their house that they rented together all the time. And I would go to these parties, but I mean, there'd be tons of people there. And, you know, everything was great for several months. Um, and then one night it was there was for some reason I just didn't really want to go. And they kept calling me like 20 times saying, come over, come over. And so finally I gave in and I go over there, and by the time I get there, my brother's already passed out drunk, so he was, you know, not even conscious. And my a friend, a good friend of mine, was actually there, and so I start drinking with her, and I have several drinks, and then she leaves, and so and I didn't realize she was gonna leave so soon. So I decide that I'm gonna leave while Chris makes this big, you know, uh scene about how I've been drinking and he takes my keys and says that I can't leave because I've, you know, had so many drinks, which I'm not even saying was wrong. You know, should should I have driven? No, absolutely not. But I knew I knew something just in my heart just didn't feel right. And these this house that they rented had three floors, and on the very top floor was just sort of like a second living room, and it had a big wraparound couch. So while people were, you know, talking and hanging out, and I thought maybe no one

Second Assault And Aftermath

JoJo Campbell 11:00

would really notice, I kind of slithered upstairs up to this top floor where no one else was, and I completely passed out on this couch, thinking, okay, maybe no one will know I'm up here. And the next morning I wake up, I'm laying on on the couch, and it's early because I can tell like it's the light is just starting to break through the the blinds. And and I, you know, I well had been drinking heavily the night before, so um it's taking me a minute or two to kind of figure out, okay, remember where I'm at, why I'm here, you know, what's going on. And I I just know that I don't feel right. And I it this all happens within a relatively quick amount of time that I realize that my pants and my underwear are pulled completely down, and my shirt and my bra are pushed up, and there is a hand in between my legs, and I look down and I look at this hand and I follow it, I follow the arm to a body that is laying on the floor beside me, and it's Chris, and I am horrified, and I know and I can tell that intercourse has happened. And I just I just jumped up and I ran out of there, I ran downstairs, I tore that downstairs apart looking for my keys, I found them, and then I went straight home and I got in the shower for hours. And I I and obviously I don't recommend that. I know that's not what you're supposed to do. Um, but at the time I just was on autopilot and um I didn't really know what to do and or what to think, and I knew later on that I again had to tell my brother. And I'm thinking, of course, now he's gonna, you know, really do something or or think something here because and I'm feeling and I feel bad because I'm like, what's he gonna do? He's gonna probably want to move out of there. Like, you know, he's gonna have to move out of there. He can't live with my rapist. And and so I'm thinking all these things and I'm feeling terrible about it, you know, for him. And I don't remember why, but I do remember that this conversation happened on the phone where I told him what happened. And I he didn't even let me get it out. Like once he kind of saw where I was going,

Disbelief And Victim Blaming

JoJo Campbell 14:02

where like what I started to talk about, he stopped me and he said, and I swear I'm this is verbatim because it's engraved in my brain. He said, I don't believe you. And if, and I mean if this really happened, it's your fault for putting yourself in the position for it to happen. Wow. Yeah.

Fatima Bey 14:32

What bullshit? Oh, go ahead.

JoJo Campbell 14:34

Right, it's exactly, and I was so stunned. I was so that was not the reaction I was planning, or you know, thinking that he was gonna give. And I literally, you know, again, I'm 19 years old, I'm young, I so I literally didn't do or say anything. I kept it to myself, and I stopped hanging out over there. I never went over there again. Um, but I never did anything with that for years.

Fatima Bey 15:13

And how was your relationship with your brother after that?

JoJo Campbell 15:18

Looking back on that, um, probably not the greatest, but at the time I didn't even realize that. Like I I think I was trying so hard to have this quote unquote normal sibling relationship um that I overlooked a lot of things and I took a lot of insults that were thrown my way and and just, you know, didn't let them get to me um for the sake of like keeping the peace and making keeping everything easy. But I did actually end up moving um 12 hours away because I got married and and all that. So um there was then some distance put there, which I think kind of helped that situation, but it also it it also just kept made it further to ever be talked about.

Fatima Bey 16:22

So I want to ask you this, and I I I'm I'm gonna talk to the audience for one second. I wanted JoJo to tell her story because I know for a fact that there are probably thousands of young girls listening right now who are where Jojo was. You've been through that situation and somebody didn't believe you if you even opened up at all. But we're gonna talk about what Jojo has done with that and where she is with it now. Because I know it's relevant to so many people listening who are silently suffering. I wanna point something out also. One of the first things you said, JoJo, was you were thinking about how it was gonna affect your brother. You were feeling guilty about something that you had no reason to feel guilty about. Right. And I'm pointing that out because there's so many young women right now who also feel guilty for something that wasn't their fault. Should you have been drunk, like you said, nope. But you were. But stuff like this happens to people who are sober. So to me, alcohol is not the main issue. Right, right. Because there's other stories, there's plenty of other stories where people were coerced in different ways. But but uh so eventually you and your bro, you had to eventually uh change your relationship with your brother. So can you tell us about that?

JoJo Campbell 17:50

Yeah, absolutely. So this is actually where things even take another turn and get even a little more crazy. Um so while I lived uh when I moved 12 hours away, um, you know, occasionally I would come up and visit and um and very rarely, I mean, I I guess occasionally we would maybe talk on the phone, but that was never really anything, you know, more than a couple minutes. And so most of our interaction would be when I came home. And this was now, you know, quite a few years later. Um, you know, I'm up visiting, and

Years Later The Apology

JoJo Campbell 18:30

by this point, this isn't something we just do not talk about. It's sort of that elephant in the room, you know, like it just does not get brought up. Um, but I, you know, put on a smile all the time and tried to be a good sister and um show up in the ways that I thought was the way I was supposed to. And I was surprised one time when I was there. My brother came to me and he apologized to me. And he brought up the situation with Chris, and he said that what happened was there were some women in the National Guard that came forward and made the same accusations about Chris. Not surprised. Right. And so once that happened, and that was at that time, and it just recently happened, um, he then realized that I had been telling the truth. And so he apologized to me, which I did accept the apology because I never even thought I would get that.

Fatima Bey 19:44

Right.

JoJo Campbell 19:44

But I'm not gonna lie, it really bothered me that it took other people's words, like my word alone was not good enough.

Fatima Bey 19:53

No, you're just the emotional little sister.

JoJo Campbell 19:55

Right, exactly. Exactly. Um, but I accepted the apology and I I actually felt like, you know, some closure from it. Um and I was really happy that that he had, you know, he came to me about it. So I'm I feel good about this. And then, you know, so I go home and you know, about a year, I don't even think it was a year later, um, by this point I'm pregnant with my son, and my brother is getting married um to his second wife. And so

The Wedding Best Man Shock

JoJo Campbell 20:34

I come up for the wedding, and I'm, you know, probably like seven months pregnant at this time. And I so we my husband and I drive up 12 hours, and we get there to the rehearsal dinner, and I walk in, and I guess who was the best man. Seriously. I'll give you three guesses. Did I say that out loud? I'll give you three guesses. It was Chris Chris or Chris, which one? Yes. Um, immediately I was I felt like someone had punched me right in the face. Um yeah. And I that apology was now null and void um to me. And that was the first time I ever sort of spoke up. Um I and this is not to blame or shame my mother in any way, um, but I came to her and my stepdad at the time. And I I don't remember exactly what I said. I I don't remember if I actually said what Chris had done. Um, I I kind of have a feeling I probably didn't say exactly like those words, but I was pretty. Much told to zip it that this was their special day and not to ruin it. And so I did. I attended the wedding and the reception and listened to him give the best man toast and everybody laugh hysterically at his jokes and be at, you know, the family, you know, the the events of that wedding. Um and then I hightailed it back home right after because I didn't want to stay. But um so yeah, so from that moment it it was like, okay, my my brother truly is is tone deaf. He doesn't care about me. And he to me, what a man is and what a big brother is, is someone who stands up for what's right and stands up and defends especially their little sister. And it was like he was, you know, consorting with the enemy.

Fatima Bey 23:14

I he was more it was it's obvious to me, based on what you've been telling me. It's obvious to me that he was more loyal to his friend than he was to you from the get-go. And probably was that way his whole entire life. It never, ever, ever, ever is just a moment. It's always the moment is always a manifestation of what's already there. Right. Um, that that's that's what I see. Um listening to that story just made me very uncomfortable in a lot of, I would say, probably good ways. Um and I mean you let him live, so you're better than me. Um is he still walking around alive with all his body parts? Now, um, as a host of a show, I'm not supposed to say stuff like that. But I just did. Um, so no, but it's it's very upsetting hearing all of that. Um and what I what the reason I wanted you to tell your story because I know people can relate to a lot of bits and pieces of what you just said.

JoJo Campbell 24:16

Yeah.

Fatima Bey 24:17

Because in so many ways, uh a lot of it is average. It shouldn't be, right? But a lot of it is average. And so you eventually, what I wanted to talk about was the fact that you no longer speak to your brother. Right. Where between where you left off and when you made that decision of I ain't talking to this fool anymore.

Loss Depression And The Intervention

Fatima Bey 24:40

When did that happen and how did it happen? What made you make that decision?

JoJo Campbell 24:44

Sure. So um, you know, at some point, I don't remember exactly how long, it was a couple years later, um, my husband and I got a divorce. And so I moved back home. So now I'm, you know, back in a very close quarters, you know, close uh geographically. And, you know, again, it was like over time, just whenever we would be at a you know, family gathering, um he would just make little jabs and little insults my way that I don't know if he thought he was being funny, if he thought, you know, I don't know. But I always just took it and took it and took it. And I never, you know, ruffled any feathers. I just let, you know, let things go the way they were. And then I kind of entered into what I consider the worst time of my life. It was uh several years where just a bunch of stuff happened that just went wrong, right? Um, I had gotten married, I had been remarried. Um my second husband and I, we we had gotten pregnant, um, and our daughter was born stillborn. So that happened, right? So that and that's you know, that was the worst day of my life. Um my brother did not so much as even send me a text or call. Wow, you know, nothing. Um, my best friend of 20 years, literally the best friend anyone in the world could ever hope for, uh, she just died suddenly one day. Um, just had a heart attack and died. And um my I had my own business at the time. And because of just all of the my emotional state and everything, I really just kind of gave up and I lost my business. So it was just one thing after the other, I was not doing well mentally. And it it was such a deep, dark depression that, you know, I stopped wearing makeup. I it I was it was lucky if I even brushed my hair, you know, that uh each day. Um and so I just didn't care about a lot of things, superficial things that I used to care about. And I don't know all the ins and outs of this, but for some reason, my brother gets together with my mother and they suspect that maybe I have a drug problem. And they invite me over for, I guess, the smallest, saddest intervention. And once I realized what's happening, because I don't realize what we're even talking about at first, because I never had a drug problem. Um, when I realize what is happening, I immediately am on level 10, furious, like you've got to be kidding me. Because it's like all of these things that had happened to me that I was dealing with, it's like no one, no one cared. Not, and I don't mean no, when I say no, and I don't, my mom always cared. That was not directed at her. Um, this was definitely directed at my brother, that you know, when A, B, C, and D things all happened, he didn't care. He wasn't there, he didn't ask me how I was doing or offer any type of support or condolences or anything. But at the mere suggestion or thought that I am doing something that puts me in a bad light or makes it look like I'm doing something wrong, oh, he's there. Oh, he's there to show up and he and be there, and you know, which was bullshit. And I was so angry about that that I made the decision to go

Choosing No Contact To Heal

JoJo Campbell 29:05

no contact. And for at first, for uh quite some time, my decision was no contact, except at times when we have to be at the same place, like you know, maybe something going on with my mom, and um, I will be cordial. And I'm not saying that that changed to where I will never, ever, ever be cordial in certain situations, but I definitely changed it to more of a no contact regardless, um, because it it things just kept progressing. Like, even though I went no contact, well, then now he tries to tell my mother things and and kind of get her against me, which it doesn't work, but just the fact that he tries, it's like because I went no contact, like he can't say things directly to me to get to me, so he'll try to do it at a with a third party. And um that's kind of where things have that's the direction everything went. But I will say that as far as I know, the last I'm gonna say maybe almost year, um, there hasn't been any um issues as far as him trying to say anything or get my mom upset with me or anything like that.

Fatima Bey 30:42

So let's talk about the no contact and why you uh let's take a deeper dive anyway into why you went no contact. Um, you just told us the whole story about what led up to no contact. Well, I wouldn't say the whole story because I know there's bits and pieces that we don't have enough time to get into, but but the general story um uh of why you went no contact. So what would it have looked like had you stayed in contact with him? Why was that decision good for you?

JoJo Campbell 31:11

So I think that something that I realized as I got older was that it is okay to need to love people from afar. I don't hate my brother. I I I love him, he's my brother, but I I don't love or respect anything that he has done towards me. And I can't have him or someone like that that I feel is almost like they would they they actively want to see me fail or see me hurt. I can't have that a person like that in my life. Why? What damage does it do? It's it is incredibly exhausting and depleting to feel like you have to be on guard with someone that's supposed to love you and supposed to protect you. And right it's it's but when you remove that from your life, it's you can breathe again.

Fatima Bey 32:34

Let me ask you this. Had you s remained in contact with him, you would have kept receiving the negativity, you would have kept receiving the snide remarks uh for something that was traumatizing and extremely sensitive. Right. What would that have done had you kept that coming at you and kept that connection of someone throwing that at you constantly in your life? What would that have done to you mentally?

JoJo Campbell 33:00

Right. That is such a great question. Uh I can only imagine how difficult that would have been to to constantly feel like I'm, you know, bobbin and weaving different insults or or just different, you know, things being said. And I I think that it's really hard to be nice to yourself and tell yourself positive things if the people around you are not loving and positive towards you or about you. So you said it, yes. Yeah. When you when you surround yourself with people that do anything to uh upset you or just bring negativity to you, well then that's what

Relatives Versus Chosen Family

JoJo Campbell 34:00

you feel and that's what your your life sort of becomes and it emulates. But if you find your people and those are the people that want to lift you up, and that's that's why one of my favorite favorite quote is the blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb. And people get they could get confused by that because they've shortened it to blood is thicker than water. And they that's not what that means. What that means is that the people who are your family, you know, they're they're there because they have to be, because they're tied by blood. But the but your real family, the people that really love you, are there by choice. They don't have to be there, but they choose to be there. And I think that that is such a an important lesson in life, is that it is hard sometimes, but it takes time. But you have to find your tribe.

Fatima Bey 35:06

You have to find your people. One of the principles, you just touched on one of the principles that I teach constantly, and that is that family are the people that you choose to have around you. Relatives are only related by blood. Your brother's not family, he's a relative. Right. And there are so many listening out there right now who can identify with so much of what you said, who have relatives that they're trying to force to be family. And sometimes it's okay to let that go. Because you just said it yourself that sometimes you you we can be better if we don't have the negative reinforcements and the negative uh the negative people attached to us. I think this is a good analogy. I would say people like your brother are like, uh, you know, we go to a hospital and we get I we get set up with an IV and the fluids go into your arm. Sometimes we need to disconnect the IV because what they're giving you is poison. And sometimes those people came from the same bloodline.

JoJo Campbell 36:10

Yeah.

Fatima Bey 36:12

That's a good quote I just came up with. So it's true. But but you know, but seriously, it it is it's it's so much of your story infuriates me because of just how wrong it is and how backwards uh some people's thinking actually is. You know, you want to look at them and go, what the hell's wrong with you? Some of you actually do say that to their face. Um I might. So don't get in my face. I might say that. But, you know, but beyond what's wrong with them, I'm very glad, Jojo, that you have made the decision. And it's not a feeling, it's a decision. That you made the decision that you're going to put yourself first and put your own betterment and your own mental health first and not allow uh an IV full of shit to be attached to you. That's my analogy for that. Um, you know, I I'm really glad that you made that decision and it's a healthier space for you. Doesn't mean that everything is healed, it doesn't mean that everything's perfect. And I'm not saying that part for you, I'm saying that part for the audience because sometimes people think, well, I make one decision and presto changio, everything's great. And real life doesn't work that way. Right. It just doesn't, you know. But part of our healing is making decisions on who we who we don't have attached to us, who we don't have around us, the surroundings that we don't have. That matters as much as the surroundings that we do have. And I'm really glad that you came on to tell your story. And I want to ask you, um, I want you to talk to the audience for the young Jojo's that are out there right now who have been, I'm sorry, who

Advice To Survivors Trust Yourself

Fatima Bey 38:00

are where you were. They have had this sexual assault in one form or another. And they haven't talked about it. They have, or they've been not believed, or they know they can't go and talk to their mother because she's gonna tell them to shut the hell up or whatever. What do you have to say to the young JoJo who's out there listening right now, who is where you were? Definitely.

JoJo Campbell 38:23

So the first thing I think is that I would what I really, really want young women to be able to do is to be able to trust themselves sooner than what a lot of us end up doing. You know, we a lot a lot of us don't do it until we're much older. And, you know, I I spent years overriding my instincts to like keep peace, keep relationships, keep family dynamics. Usually it when that voice in your head is screaming at you, there's a reason.

Fatima Bey 39:00

Yes.

JoJo Campbell 39:01

And I think a lot of girls are raised to be understanding, forgiving, accommodating, basically, you know, tiny emotional support employees for everybody. And that's an interesting way to put it, right? And those qualities can be beautiful, but they they can also very easily turn into self-abandonment. And so I really want these young girls to just understand that setting boundaries is not cruelty. Sometimes setting boundaries comes from grief and maybe accepting that you can love someone and still not be emotionally safe with them. So you have to put some distance there. Um but really I think the biggest thing is just trusting that little voice inside your head when you know something's not right. Or that someone around you in in your orbit shouldn't be there.

Fatima Bey 40:17

I think we really need to trust ourselves more. You know what? I I think that is excellent advice. Um probably I've gotten a lot of good advice from my guests, um, for real. I really have, but I think that's in my top ten because I just you didn't know this, but I just did an episode maybe a month or two ago, so very recently, um, called You Knew. And that's exactly what that episode's about. Listen to your inner voice. You knew not to date that person. You knew this person was gonna be abusive, you knew this person's trying to control you, you knew that wasn't the job, whatever. And I I I just want to piggyback on that. You already know young ladies, and I'm talking to young, well, really young men too, because there have been young men in situations like yours. Sure. So and just as much as women, so let me say young young ladies and young men. They just don't get to talk about it the same way we do. Yeah. Um, but young ladies and young ladies and young men, you you already, you really already know if you've been wronged, it's don't take the blame on yourself and think about how everybody else is gonna feel about it. It's not that you shouldn't think about that, but it shouldn't be the the first thing you think about. You need to think, take care of yourself. And but you know, as as JoJo just said, the hard thing for a lot of you to do is to put those boundaries in place because people tell you you're being emotional, people tell you being ridiculous. Why would you treat your brother like that? Why would you treat your mother like that? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You gotta protect yourself because if you don't, who will? Right. Right?

Healing With Humor And Jojo’s Podcast

Fatima Bey 42:05

No, uh, Jojo, what it uh you have a podcast called No Hard Feelings. Kinda. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Absolutely.

JoJo Campbell 42:18

Um, basically, it is a place where people get to share their stories, whether it's a traumatic story or a crazy story, it doesn't matter what it is, but um, we just really focus on healing with humor. And uh because, you know, sometimes you gotta laugh to keep from crying. And one of the things that I think a lot of people, not maybe not everybody, and that's okay, but a lot of people, when we go through hard times, the dark times, we develop a little bit of dark humor. And that's okay. There's nothing wrong with that. I don't think that should be shamed at all. And so this is just a really great place where everybody's super supportive. We actually have a private Facebook group that people just kind of hang out and feel like, you know what, there's no judgment here. And um, that's really the the basis of my my podcast is to let there be a space for people to talk about things in their life and and laugh at the absurdity of it.

Fatima Bey 43:26

And um for the audience, I was recently a guest on on her show. Yeah. Um, and I'm picky about what shows I go on now. So I recommend that you do listen to her because what's rare about uh Jojo's uh podcast, and I'm bringing it up because it's relevant to to this audience, actually. When JoJo well, so okay, so what I love about her podcast is that she does actually a really good job at mixing humor, the dark humor piece, with the real serious, heavy stuff, like the stuff that I talk about a lot. Um, and it's it's Not easy to find somebody who has that balance. Now they now she talked about some crazy stuff, it's just crazy. But because it's funny, because it's just crazy. But but she also has just as many uh episodes that people talk about really deep, dark stuff. Oh, yeah. That's just really heavy, really, really heavy. And what I what I like is that again, you bring in the humor, but I want to say this to the audience. The reason I'm pointing out her podcast is I do recommend that you listen to it. You got to listen to more than one episode because they are definitely not all the same. But there is a point in the dark humor. I used to think that people with dark humor were just stupid and wrong. I'm just being real blunt and honest. Why this is serious and heavy because I've always been that person. If it's serious and heavy, I'm very intense. Um, I might be cracking up, making the whole room crack up, and five minutes later, sitting there in tears with somebody. Um, like that's that's just me. But the dark humor piece, I no longer believe that before I met JoJo because I understand people better now. Some of you have that dark humor, and it's a coping mechanism. Let's call it what it is. It's a coping mechanism. But what I want to say to all of you, there's nothing wrong with that, as long as you don't use that as your only coping mechanism, because that's masking and that's not the same thing. So sometimes it's a bridge. I would say it's a coping mechanism that's a bridge to actual healing. But it can be a bridge for some of you. So for those of you who are out there, especially the younger generation, seems to me does it a lot more than my generation did. If you are the person that has that dark humor and you're just trying to cope, that's okay. Just make sure it's not your only coping mechanism. I that's just a little piggyback thing I wanted to add there. So um uh how can people find your podcast, Jojo?

JoJo Campbell 45:53

So I am everywhere that you get your podcasts. And um, if you just search literally at no hard feelings, kinda, I'll come right up.

Fatima Bey 46:06

Yep, and there'll be um on the episode page, I will have links to all of her social um and to her website as well. Um, so Jojo, I really appreciate you coming on. I I have absolutely enjoyed talking to you. You really are a storyteller. Um, and but I think that that in today's instance, that's really, really good because we could all experience the story with you. Um thank you once again for coming on, and I I I wish you very well.

JoJo Campbell 46:34

Oh, thank you so much for having me. It was an absolute pleasure, and I appreciate it. Thanks so much. Thank you.

Mind Shifting Moment And Closing

Fatima Bey 46:43

And now for a mind-shifting moment. I want to point out uh something that we talked about throughout this episode, but I think is a principle worth pointing out so it can sink in a little bit deeper. And that is that a relative is not the same thing as family. For many of you, you have relatives that are family, but many of you have relatives that aren't. So just because you share the same bloodline, that makes them a relative. That means biologically, you say you share some biological elements, but your family, those are the people you choose. And if you're not sure who's family and who's a relative around you, let this be your test. When you are really in need, when you're down and out, when you're having an emotional moment, when something traumatic happens in your life, who's there for you? That's your family. Whether or not they're related to you isn't relevant. Your family is who you choose to have as close in your life. And it matters. It matters for you greatly, and I want to see you have the best support you possibly can. So I want you to think about not who your relatives are, but who's your family, and choose wisely. You've been listening to Mind Shift Power Podcast for complete show notes on this episode, and to join our global movement, find us at FatimaBey.com. Until next time, always remember there's power in shifting your thinking.