Welcome And Why Reentry Matters

Fatima Bey 0:04

This is Mind Shift Power Podcast, the number one critically acclaimed podcast where we have raw, unfiltered conversations that shape tomorrow. I'm your host, Fatima Bay, the Mind Shifter. And welcome everyone. Today we have with us Tavon J. Partlow Sr. He is out of Maryland in the USA. He is the founder of Re-entry, Recovery, and Beyond, also known as Founder Lowe. And today's episode, we are specifically talking to young men coming out of incarceration in the U.S. and those around them. So how are you today, Tavon?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 0:45

Hey, thank you for the invite. I'm doing pretty swell. Thank you for asking.

Fatima Bey 0:49

And thank you for coming on. I've been looking forward to having this conversation with someone who can with the right person, and that's you. So I like to dive right in. So tell us, why are you on this podcast and what do you do?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 1:04

Well, thank you again. Thank you for the brief, a brief introduction. I am the founder of Re-Entry Recovery Beyond. I am an advocate for people like me, such as myself. I am someone who understands struggle, adversity, and redemption firsthand. So what I like to do is I like to get family members, friends, peers, uh, coworkers, everyone around us to understand what we've been through, what we're still going through, and how to assist us uh opposed to harming us as we re-enter into society.

Fatima Bey 1:38

And I think what you do is very, very, very important. I think there are many precious gems that God has created that end up incarcerated. And their value is still buried inside. But we tend to see the dust that's on them instead of the gem that's inside of them. And I love that you help them to enter into the world. So let me ask you this. You

The First Shock After Release

Fatima Bey 2:06

know, after coming out of incarceration, when you walk out of those doors, what hits first that nobody tells you about? Not the inspiring stuff, but what's the reality check?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 2:17

Well, one of the biggest reality checks is that as soon as we come home, especially we have a a support system, whether it's small or big, the first per first thing people say to us is they say, Aren't you glad you're free? Or welcome home, freedom. And just understanding what it means to be free is is a problem in itself. Um when we first uh come home from those gates. Because are we actually free? We're still persecuted as though we're still on trial. And that comes from, you know, uh multiple standpoints. But when we first step out and we don't have any shackles on, we don't have any guards, you know, pushing us along, it's like, man, what do I do? What do I do now?

Fatima Bey 3:07

So what are the other things that are going through, you know, a person's mind when they get out? Like what are they thinking about? Okay, yeah, you're free, but then what?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 3:22

So the main things is like, okay, depending on if you have family, uh, children, uh spells, or you know, siblings, or or if you don't have one anyone at all, it's like s uh survival. Survival kicks in again in a different fashion and form. It's not really like a a gorilla effect, but it's it's real life effect of money, shelter, clothing, food. We think about a lot of things that how can I get this? Um, where would I get it from? How do I get a job with no place? I have I don't have an ID. I don't, I don't, I don't even so much things, so many things change from cell phones to buildings to structures, everything around us, roads, even bus lines. Nothing's the same when we go to prison and we come home, especially if you do a long time in prison. When I went to prison, I was 20 years old and my space was out. It was no Facebook, it was no Instagram, it wasn't none of these glamorous apps that we have today. iPhone wasn't anymore out. I went when I went to prison, we had boost mobile, walkie-talkie phones. So when I came home to this, it was just a lot to take on.

Fatima Bey 4:33

So since we're talking specifically to young men, I want to point something out that you just said. Because some people like, yeah, that's because you were in for a long time. You were in for 13 years, correct?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 4:46

12. 12.

Fatima Bey 4:47

Am I correct in that? 12, okay. So someone might say, oh, you were in for 12 years. That one, that one happened when our young, when, when we're young, it's not gonna be different when we get out. And I'm laughing. I'm laughing when I say that because I can't say it with a straight face. Technology changes so fast, you could be in for two years and come out in a different world. It's it's so true. But what I'm hearing from what you're saying, uh, what I'm gathering from what you're saying is it it's when you first get out, it's not just okay, yes, I'm free, but it's emotional and mental overwhelm. Because that's what I'm hearing you explain. You're like, how am I gonna get this? And girlfriend and children and spouses and and uh siblings, whatever. How am I gonna, you know, it's that's a lot. That's a lot to have going on in your head all at once. And at the same time, you said, are you really free? What do you mean by that?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 5:44

So

Are You Really Free After Prison

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 5:45

a lot of us come home on probation, parole, home, home monitor. And then if you are strapping yourself to we have to be realistic, right? What I tell men and women is we have to be realistic. You come home, you've been talking to your past or previous girlfriend, wife, husband before, and you expect everything to be the same. Y'all may have grew apart because you're definitely different coming home from prison. We sleep in twin-size bed, metal cots. We eat three times a day on a clocked-around schedule. Um, we walk in a single-file line, we have to get passes as adults. Our lifestyle is drastically changed from the real world. And that's one of the biggest things we have to communicate. Communication is the number one uh factor of any relationship. We have to know how to speak. And for the voices, again, for the voices who can't speak, I am that advocate. I am that mediator, that mentor who helps men and women who cannot speak or have that voice to advocate for themselves. We have to be able to communicate to the people around us on how we're feeling. Um at at every at every point. It doesn't matter how how small or how big, if you're feeling frustrated. That's another thing. Awareness. Awareness. I'm sorry, I gotta I gotta say this right here. Awareness, right? Triggers. We have to understand what triggers us, triggers us when we start, you get that rocking, or your blood starts boiling, or your face starts flinching, or your eyes start twitching. You have to understand that it's something going on with you mentally at that moment, and you have to speak on it and move yourself from that situation. I just had to say that real.

Fatima Bey 7:38

No, that's I I'm glad you brought that out because it's a very important point. Since we're talking about this, let me ask you this. You when it comes to, we're talking about your mental state and emotional state when you when you come out for a lot of people, and there are different variances of everything we just said for each person depending on the situation. But when when you come out, you got all this mental stuff coming on. You you're expected to switch from one mindset and environment to another, which are drastically different from each other, like you just explained. You're expected to switch. And at the same time, you have all these questions and and concerns going on in your head. How many young men, when they come out, have actual, real therapeutic support? Like, is are there therapists, um, whether they go by that title or not, do they have any sort of real, actual um what's the word I'm looking for? Resources for the mental help that they need in that moment, that any of us would need in that moment.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 8:48

Yes. So

Therapy, Insurance, And Breaking Stigma

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 8:49

there are there are a few areas and places where brothers like myself, brothers and sisters like myself could go, but the issue is funding. Um the number one thing we have to do. So I'm also a certified community health worker, so I give these type of resources. Immediately out of prison, we have to get uh government benefits. We have to get govern uh uh state insurance, we have to get all the help that they have to offer us because we are indigent. We do we don't have funds, and we need, we need things. So one of the main things is health insurance.

Fatima Bey 9:25

Right.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 9:25

And health insurance um covers uh therapeutic uh services. So yes, they do have it.

Fatima Bey 9:32

My next question to that it's available, but how many actually take advantage of it? Because just because something is available doesn't people do people actually use it. They don't. So I thought that was the generational curse.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 9:48

Mm-hmm. No, no, no. We have to no no. We have to break the generational curses. Uh uh we we may have heard it a law a lot of times in our own households. If it doesn't apply to you, let it fly. But in a lot of our households, especially in the African-American culture, a lot of a lot of parents say, I don't need a shrink. I don't need no head doctors, nothing wrong with me. Well, the issue is you don't know if something's wrong with you, you never diagnose, or you don't get checked. Just like you get your body checked, we have to get mentally checked. This is all a muscle that we use on a daily basis. Our brain controls our whole every function of our body. So we have to understand that sometimes we gotta get that checked. We gotta get that checked. And I'm an advocate for therapists and for people like myself, uh, you know, who are in re-entry because therapists are there to help. I actually have been in therapy since I've been home from prison. I was one of those guys who said, hey, look, man, if I don't get therapy, I feel my whole body feels like it's about to erupt and I'm gonna go back to prison. So I s uh so I I uh went out and and got the services that I needed.

Fatima Bey 10:57

And I'm glad that you did. And I wanted to bring that up because a lot of um, and you're right. I think it's especially harder for men, I'll be honest with you. I'm a woman, I'm not a man, but I uh but I do understand humans in our culture in in the US, and I really think it's harder for men to to seek out the help that they get. But I will say this it is actually, it takes more courage and it makes you a stronger man if you do go get the help you need than if you pretend that you don't. I mean, that's just my feeling in general, uh, for everyone, not just men. But I I really think that I understand why why they wouldn't. I understand why it's it's hard for them. Um, so I'm not saying that as a statement of judgment, but I would love to see more more men who come out or young men who come out like you, just simply go get the help that you need. And you know, when you are in therapy, it's nobody knows what you're saying there. It's it's closed. So if you felt like you said something embarrassed, nobody knows, you know. And I I I get that. I get that. And but I wanted to, I wanted, I wanted to bring that up because I think it's so important. Um so people uh when when you get out, people are going to treat you differently just because you have a record. I mean, that's just reality. Some will judge you, some won't give you a chance, some will surprise you. How do you move through that uh without letting it kill you? And where is it that actually your responsibility versus the world's problem? Because there's a difference.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 12:41

Right. So you're talking about self-responsible or self-accountability, or you're talking about what my company does or what I stand for?

Fatima Bey 12:49

Well, for those for those coming out, because you you can tie that into what your company does. Yeah.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 12:57

Well, so the main thing is being aware of, so I'm so glad that you're asking these. These are some great questions because I talk about a lot when it comes to accountability. We have to, we so my advice is this,

Accountability, Belief, And New Networks

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 13:15

right? It's simple. Don't let your past become your permanent address. Simple as that. Take accountability for your mistakes, but don't live in them. Invest in yourself. We have to read books, we have to find mentors, we have to get education, learn a trade, build positive relationships. Now, as far as controlling people around us, we know we can't control no one. We only can control ourselves. But we can control how people see us, the change in us. It's how we show up every day, we're on time, we're making that positive step forward, and we're not doing anything negative. Then they can witness the change. And these people become our references when we try to get jobs, when we try to get homes, when we try to get business loans. Um So I just think it's uh it's just great to build to build great relationships by networking. And the best networking is uh with people with understanding. And it just is what it is. You know, we gotta call a spade a spade. We have to change people, places, and things. We can't hang around the same situations that got us where we were in the beginning.

Fatima Bey 14:29

Amen. I wanted to say so much more to just amen there, but that I well, very well said, Tivon, very well said. Um, I ask that because uh a particular type of person um will sometimes, it's true people don't give you a chance. It's true that people judge you. It's true everything I just said. But sometimes people will use that as an excuse for no accountability and for no effort. So that's really what I what I was uh was I was speaking to because I I know that everything you just said is absolutely true. But there are there are people who are just like, no, see, the man's trying to keep me down, everybody's trying to keep me down. It's everybody else's fault. And although there's some truth to that, that doesn't diminish, as, you know, as you just explained, your their own responsibility, right?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 15:24

Right. So those people, um, I call them the third eye people, which is nothing wrong with having a third eye. That's that is actually a powerful uh part of thinking. But we have to understand they can try, but the word is a try. We can always make them fail. And I am a proven walking light, an image of that, that they could try everything they want. But I still was able to get my master's degree. I still was able to get my CDLA, drive trucks all over America on parole and probation. I'd touched over 44 states in America. Um, and it's just like, especially, so what I also tell men is like, once you leave where you're from, if you're listening to this, let's say I'm from Baltimore, Maryland. So let's say if you were listening to this in California, when you leave California and you come over here to the to the East Coast and you go down south and you see the differences in prices and stuff, you're gonna see it's a different world just from that. You know, just just from that.

Fatima Bey 16:31

That alone, yeah, that's true. But the when you see, when you travel over a place like you have, you do see the difference in cultures because America doesn't just have the U.S. doesn't just have one culture, like it's portrayed. We have several cultures within our country, and you get to see them if when you travel. But I love the fact that you have a okay, you have a master, you just listed a list of things that a lot of people coming out thinking that they can't do. And you're you're living proof that they can. So what's the difference between you and the one who says that they can't?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 17:06

It's belief. It's belief. Like I said in the beginning, they the man can try to hold you down, but the word is they can try. The that the question, the real question would be, will you let them?

Fatima Bey 17:20

I love the way you just said that. You're so right.

How Loved Ones Can Support Reentry

Fatima Bey 17:26

So I want you to talk to a certain audience right now. The people who are around young men who are coming out of incarceration, the mothers, the sisters, the partners, what do they need to understand about what their son, brother, or man is going through that might help them actually support them instead of accidentally making it harder?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 17:47

So I like analogies, parables, and metaphors. And we can use we can use anything in this situation that has to be, you know, when you're shipping a box and it has glass in it, on the box it is labeled fragile. But we all know that some packages come to us what? Broken. They still get broken. So everyone around us is not gonna be uh perfect. They're not gonna handle us with care. But that's our accountability, and that's what we have to understand. Everyone is not gonna be nice. We're gonna have some evil people, negative people around us. Uh, even if it's our bosses, uh, like I might be working, and boss might say, You're nothing but a low life anyway, because he knows my he had to hire me so he knows my background. Um, or we might have a spouse that we made a uh broken bridges with and she took us back and said, You just gonna do the same thing anyway. We have those people. But what I tell people around us is that treat us like we're fragile glass. Treat us like us, like we are newborn babies, infants, because we are. Some of the you have some of the nicest people in the world who will save your life are in prison. I watched a man perform CPR. I watched a man perform, give another man stitches. I watched another man, it's so many, it's so many levels, because we gotta remember, you'll never know who you're around. It may be an ex-con right next to you. And you'll never know. We are some of the nicest people, and we are, most of us are really go-getters. We just made poor choices. And people just gotta understand that we made poor choices for fast money, for whatever it is. And like, for instance, John Q. Uh, if you ever seen the movie John Q, if y'all never seen it, you should check it out. It was a father who uh held the hospital hostage so that his child could get a I believe it was a heart transpermation.

Fatima Bey 19:51

Oh, wait, who started that? Who started that?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 19:55

Washington.

Fatima Bey 19:56

Oh, I did. That was a good movie. I did see it.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 19:59

So this man, this man did this for for his child. Of course it was wrong, but the morality of it was right. It depends on how you look at it. When you think about morality, man, your moral compass gotta be aligned with what the greatness of God wants. So it's all in how you everything is with perception. Or that man who went into the store who was his children were st are starving, and he wanted to get them something to eat, so he stole from it. He didn't steal from it for himself, he stole for his children to eat. You go see his children, they are all malnutrition, uh, malnutrition. I think I'm saying ever correctly, no growing yard. Malnourish. But you don't want to put your match. Malnourished. Yeah. So if they are malnourished and you see this, then it then it'd be lighter, lighter sentence, or the person won't get in trouble at all. They'd be like, get him some help, or he might get in trouble for that. So now he's in double trouble because his children is malnourished and now he's been stole, but he's trying his best. So it you never know a person's circumstances when it comes to that.

Fatima Bey 21:06

Can I add to that? I also want to add, there are legitimately men and women in prison who actually shouldn't be there. And I'm mentioning that because sometimes when it doesn't matter why you got in or even what you got convicted for. Once you're a felon, you're a felon in some people's eyes, and they treat you all the same. But I want to say that, not for you, but for the listeners, keep in mind there are a lot of people in prison who actually don't belong there. How many, I don't know, but there are enough. I I just wanted to add that in there.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 21:44

And that is a fact. I'm glad that you added that because there are a lot of people who are in prison that shouldn't be prison, and there's a lot of people who are out of prison who should be in.

Fatima Bey 21:56

Amen. You said that very well. I couldn't agree with you more. Um, some of them wear three-piece suits. And um yeah, that's that's so true. So um so what I hear you saying is that we need to um basically have some sensitivity. And could you said treat treat you like newborn babies? But I know that some people will, I know what you mean, but I also know some people take that out of context. You're not saying uh baby, baby peep, baby, baby you into the point that it's annoying, but you're just saying be sensitive enough like you would be to a young woman or a child. Am I correct?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 22:38

So you so it's perception is everything, right? Um like I tell people all the time, if it don't apply, let it fly. Some people just need to mind their business. But I literally mean exactly what I said. So, like, for instance, let's say, all right, so now we gotta go into prison for a second. Well that was time. Okay, give me two minutes with this. So now we gotta go into prison with this. So in prison, you're either a wolf or you're a sheep. And we have a lot of sheep in prison, or it would be war, a war zone every day, all day, right? You gotta make it make sense. You gotta understand this clearly. So a lot of men are sheep in prison. So when they come home, they've been through war. They may have been stabbed, they may have been uh, I've seen men have to stand in tallers and quack like ducks, men under bunks, can't take a shower, can't use the phone, can't buy commissary because the because the wolves are around. Um and the wolves are the are the you know your your your gang members, your your animalistic people. Uh and you like you said, you have some people who don't belong in prison. So most of the time it's these people, they need to cry. They do. And I say that honestly in all love that those people need to be coddled. Or they can become the the the predator. That's another reason why I'm glad you brought up therapy, too, because therapy is important.

Fatima Bey 24:04

Yes.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 24:04

But I'm I'm still keeping the same notion of treat us like fragile glass, you know, when you talk to us. Because so let's say, for instance, we get into an argument with someone in prison. We know that if you back down, you could be looked at as soft. But if y'all come to a mutual yelling, then y'all both are equal. So we are used to not talking soft to people. So we may be, it may seem aggressive, but we're not. We just getting our point across. And that could come off as aggression because we're passionate. Um, a lot of people take that for aggression, which is which is very false. Now, hands-on, we do, we we come from a place where you've got to protect yourself at all times. So we do be paranoid. You know, you know, we paranoid people. It is what it is. Take it with it for what it is. Um, so we're we're conscious when it comes to that also. That's it. Just just have something. You can't empathize if you're not. Go ahead. I'm sorry.

Fatima Bey 25:03

I wanna I wanna point something out from to piggyback off of what you just said, and not for you, but for the audience. When when American soldiers, whether they're in the Marines, the Army, whatever part of the uh armed forces that they're in, when they come back from war, one of the major things that they have to do is they have to acclimate themselves back to normal society again. They go through PTSD. They are offered a lot of therapeutic services. Why do we do that? We do it because it's necessary, because they've been in a war zone. So what I'm hearing from you is that it's really not different. The details are different, but the principle is the same. When someone's coming home from prison, prison is not a fairy tale full of butterflies and cotton candy. You know, it's it's a war zone. And even if there's not a physical war zone going on, there's war zone mindset that is drilled into you while you're in there. So it is, and I think it's important to point that out because for the audience who doesn't understand that, and especially for those who are around the young men coming out, and I say young men because I'm actually going to do a separate episode for young women. That's why I'm focusing on men for this one. Uh, so for for men, for the young men who are coming out, I think it's important for all of us who are around them to understand that. Because if we couple that with what you're saying about, you know, treating them like fragile, it matters because when we do the same thing, or we're supposed to anyway, for our soldiers. We're supposed to treat them as fragile because they've been through so much, they've seen so much. They may have escaped with their lives, they may have been traumatized with the bombs going off in their ears or whatever. And, you know, the same thing for someone who's been in prison, who's had to watch things that I I'm not going to mention on this podcast happen and have been stabbed, watched happening, you know, all the stuff that you just said. And I just think it's important to point that out for those around the young men who are coming out. That you have to keep in mind they're not in the same mental place that maybe you are. They're in, they're coming from a different place. So we have to keep that in mind. And it has to be more than just a therapist who understands that. So let me ask you about this. I'm sorry, go ahead.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 27:31

I was just saying I totally agree with that, man. We have to use, we have to sympathize, though you cannot empathize, just sympathize.

Fatima Bey 27:38

Yes. Yes, sympathize. That's very important. At least try to understand. You know, even just conversations can help understanding a lot.

Housing And Jobs With A Record

Fatima Bey 27:47

Um, when it comes to housing and employment, people won't hire you. Sometimes landlords won't rent to you. Well, some people won't hire you, some will. What's the real talk on how to navigate systems that are literally designed to keep you out?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 28:05

Well, a lot of us, right? I'm gonna use, I can use, I have a friend who never had a job in his life. He did 15 years in prison. He came home. When it was time to do his resume, he was confused because jobs want to see that you worked, right? So you when we we in prison, we have to work. We have to do, we can be janitors, we can be cooks, we can do laundry, we can do grow crew. These things matter. So what you listed is not under the prison, but under the prison system, whatever where I live is DLL R. So you would put that and put the actual job duties that you did on your resume and put the years that you did them. So it still works and matters. Um how you work this? That's that's one way to work the system and just again seek out these re-entry resources that we have, because they do work and help.

Fatima Bey 28:58

And how does do does um does your program help with that?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 29:04

So my pro I'm actually the the the main mentor of my program. So what I do is I I do one-on-ones mentoring with the clients, um, and then we build them with direction and purpose. Number one thing. You have to have direction and purpose of where you hit it, what you want to do, and where you're going. And I help with that.

Fatima Bey 29:22

Oh, good. That's okay, so that's important. Um, what advice do you have for the use of the world today? Don't let your past keep you down.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 29:37

Just move forward, reach out, communicate, find a plan, stick to it. Motivated goals. Um, reach out to me. Definitely.

Fatima Bey 29:49

Yes, reach out to him. Um, Tevon is is very clearly um very passionate about this, you know. And I I'm glad that you're doing this again. I've I've said it number numerous times, on and off air. Uh, I'm glad that you're doing this, Tevon, because there are so many young men out there that need somebody like you who gets it. I can be as compassionate as I want, but I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna get it the way you get it because I haven't been through it. I've helped somebody out of prison, um, unofficially, like, you know, not as a program or anything, just as a person. But I but it's nobody can, I honestly don't just feel like most of us can't reach them the way you can because you have the experience and you're not coming to anybody with judgment, you've already been there. Um, and for these young men to have somebody that they can actually talk to, confide in, who's gonna look at them as a person and not as a conviction, um, that really matters. It matters a lot. And I also wanna I also want to point out something else here. I say this, I find myself saying this a lot on this podcast for some reason, but men have emotions too. And I say that because many cultures, not just in the US, many cultures act like men don't have emotions. And it's so far from the truth. Now, you may, men may uh display those emotions and react to them a little differently, but they have the same emotions the rest of us do. And that you just explained that a little bit earlier, Tavan, when you're talking about, you know, what you what these young men are having to deal with when they come out and all the overwhelming stuff that's going on in their head at the same time, you know, it it's to me, it's important that everybody around them, all of us who are around them, that we make it a point to make an effort, an effort to understand. Even if you don't understand, that's okay. You're you're human. Try. Just try. And that that effort can make all the difference in the world for somebody. It could be the difference between someone moving forward or going backwards.

Finding Tavon And The Bigger Vision

Fatima Bey 32:02

So, um, Tayvon, where can people find you?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 32:06

So thank you for asking that. Um, they can definitely find me on my website. It's www.reentryrecoverybeyond.com. Again, that's re-entryrecoverybeyond.com. Because that's that's I created that website, website because that's how I really feel. I believe once you re-enter, we recover, and and sky's the limit. No one can stop you from reaching the sky except for you.

Fatima Bey 32:38

And I have one more question for you. What do you think is the biggest thing that uh you see re-entry, recovery, and beyond doing? If just pick one thing that you think is the biggest, because you do a lot of things. What is the one biggest thing that you hope to be your biggest strongest impact?

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 33:00

My strongest impact is a one-stop shop. When I get all the funding that I need to facilitate this massive campus, it's gonna be like the biggest, most beautiful college slash trade campus, transitional housing, pools, basketball courts. It's gonna be my vision, it's just so big. I just need people to understand it and help me with it.

Fatima Bey 33:32

So I think that that is beautiful. I asked you that because I knew that you had a bigger vision. I wanted people to hear it that you're not just doing this because you're bored and got nothing else to do. There's there's a bigger picture at play and your heart is in it. And to me, that's what matters. That's why I asked you on the show. Um, I just love, love, love what you're doing, and please don't ever stop. Uh, if you ever get discouraged, give me a call. I will talk you out of it because I want you to keep doing what you are doing. It's so important. And once again, thank you so much for coming on.

Tavon J. Partlow Sr. 34:07

I appreciate it. I can't wait till you have me again.

Mind Shift On Mistakes And Character

Fatima Bey 34:12

And now for a mind-shifting moment. I want to talk about one of the underlying principles, one of the underlying currents of our conversation today. We talked about how people are treated when they come back home from incarceration, how they're treated at home, in society, etc. But I want to take this conversation beyond incarceration. How do you treat people who've made mistakes in the past? Do you hold them to it? Are you still talking about what your uncle did back in 1985? Are you still bringing up what somebody did back in a long time ago? Is that who they are now? And what about what you did two years ago? Should we keep bringing that up for eternity? This is the thought seed I want to plant in your head today. Treat people how you want to be treated. Are you the one mistake you made back in 2001? Is that who you are today? Probably not. Should that define your entire existence? No. Never. Treat people how you want to be treated. How do you want to be defined yourself? By your character or your mistakes of yesterday? Because quite frankly, the only difference between you and most of the people in prison is you didn't get caught. You've been listening to Mind Shift Power Podcast for complete show notes on this episode, and to join our global movement, find us at fatimabay.com. Until next time, always remember there's power in shifting your thinking.